Re-reading the old posts
Re-reading the old posts
War in Russia is a real gem.
Unfortunately a lot of the knowledge for playing the game is not effectively documented.
By going back through the old posts I am finding pearls of wisdom.
It is necessary to be comfortable and conversant with the manual to have an appreciation for the topics discussed.
Page 72 to 65 relate to version WIR v2.0, the upgrades prior to v3.0, and the anticipation of release of v3.0.
From 65 to 61 (which is as far as I have read today) the topics deal with v3.0. Discussion is about bugs, fixes, hints on gameplay and explanation of items that are confusing.
There are several discussions on the weakness of the AI and the two views on human vs human play and human vs AI. Essentially if you play against the AI follow the historical settings, ie don't change production or do anything gamey just to win and it will be a pleasant experience.
If you play against another human, there are house rules.
Page 61 has an interesting article "Campaign '44" in which one of the players just plays the air war against the AI. ie a Air Battle for Berlin.
It is faintly reminiscent of Talonsoft's Battle of Britain/12 o'clock High Bombing the Reich.
Originally posted by Mist: For those who will try to play '44. It is good idea to try "Battle for Germany" ("Battle for Britain" in opposite). Set both human controls and defend your oil/industry from AI directed strategic bombings. Quite exciting is it. It does not take as much time as whole campaign and is still very interesting to look what max can you do in air. Changing production and pool management is certanly important. P.S. Ed, Ricky! You should look at this because there are strange things happening(59 Killoton bombings, no sustains damage message etc). I have no savefile with 0.3+ probability of these events, but I had at least couple of dozen of them in '44-'45.
I never thought of it as a bombing game Regarding the no sustains massive damage, I have seen that and I think it is related to either no active factory in the city (already bombed to rubble) or it misses the target, due to bad weather or inaccurate bombers or something. I think Ed has added it to our list already as a minor bug, or at least it has been discussed. Thanks for the info on it - not having played WIR-Bombing of the Reich I didn't realize you would see it so often in the late game.
_____________________________
Rick Bancroft
Semper Fi
Unfortunately a lot of the knowledge for playing the game is not effectively documented.
By going back through the old posts I am finding pearls of wisdom.
It is necessary to be comfortable and conversant with the manual to have an appreciation for the topics discussed.
Page 72 to 65 relate to version WIR v2.0, the upgrades prior to v3.0, and the anticipation of release of v3.0.
From 65 to 61 (which is as far as I have read today) the topics deal with v3.0. Discussion is about bugs, fixes, hints on gameplay and explanation of items that are confusing.
There are several discussions on the weakness of the AI and the two views on human vs human play and human vs AI. Essentially if you play against the AI follow the historical settings, ie don't change production or do anything gamey just to win and it will be a pleasant experience.
If you play against another human, there are house rules.
Page 61 has an interesting article "Campaign '44" in which one of the players just plays the air war against the AI. ie a Air Battle for Berlin.
It is faintly reminiscent of Talonsoft's Battle of Britain/12 o'clock High Bombing the Reich.
Originally posted by Mist: For those who will try to play '44. It is good idea to try "Battle for Germany" ("Battle for Britain" in opposite). Set both human controls and defend your oil/industry from AI directed strategic bombings. Quite exciting is it. It does not take as much time as whole campaign and is still very interesting to look what max can you do in air. Changing production and pool management is certanly important. P.S. Ed, Ricky! You should look at this because there are strange things happening(59 Killoton bombings, no sustains damage message etc). I have no savefile with 0.3+ probability of these events, but I had at least couple of dozen of them in '44-'45.
I never thought of it as a bombing game Regarding the no sustains massive damage, I have seen that and I think it is related to either no active factory in the city (already bombed to rubble) or it misses the target, due to bad weather or inaccurate bombers or something. I think Ed has added it to our list already as a minor bug, or at least it has been discussed. Thanks for the info on it - not having played WIR-Bombing of the Reich I didn't realize you would see it so often in the late game.
_____________________________
Rick Bancroft
Semper Fi
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 60 to 58:
Issues regarding fixing play balance, numerous bugs surfacing, complaints of lack of information, poor AI and the difficulty in correcting problems with a flawed game engine that is hardwired.
Players are enjoying the scenario editor; introduction of Wirhack, a program that allows modifications of wir.exe. Possum mod mentioned.
More tips on gameplay and suggestions on making the game more historically accurate.
Several players and game testers are making notable contributions and suggestions.
Still about two months away from the V3.1 patch.
Issues regarding fixing play balance, numerous bugs surfacing, complaints of lack of information, poor AI and the difficulty in correcting problems with a flawed game engine that is hardwired.
Players are enjoying the scenario editor; introduction of Wirhack, a program that allows modifications of wir.exe. Possum mod mentioned.
More tips on gameplay and suggestions on making the game more historically accurate.
Several players and game testers are making notable contributions and suggestions.
Still about two months away from the V3.1 patch.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 57
More discussions on historical vs ahistorical strategies, limitations of the AI with changes to the formulas for combat routines and production. There appear to be problems with the alt/r report containing errors. Players have picked this up by using the editwir. Also because there are many changes being made(large and small), some of the changes are not noted and forgotten.
Mist provided an excellent method for learning the game:
quote:
Originally posted by Merlin: Since WIR is very detailed, it's very hard playing it. So I need help on how to play it, if you're saying "read the manual" then tell me where to start by reading it. This game is really good!!.. so help me please! Thanks in advance!
I think the most important is to understand readiness concept. The first thing I did was reading of manual couple of times. Then I marked every mention of readiness loss and readiness gain. In opposite, production is IMHO the last thing to mess with. The best way to learn how to play is to play the game for Germans in 1941 and post your questions here in forum which is pretty alive and you'll probably get the complete answer almost immediately. Manual is obsolete due to many changes which were made in last versions, but it is enough to understand game basics.
More discussions on historical vs ahistorical strategies, limitations of the AI with changes to the formulas for combat routines and production. There appear to be problems with the alt/r report containing errors. Players have picked this up by using the editwir. Also because there are many changes being made(large and small), some of the changes are not noted and forgotten.
Mist provided an excellent method for learning the game:
quote:
Originally posted by Merlin: Since WIR is very detailed, it's very hard playing it. So I need help on how to play it, if you're saying "read the manual" then tell me where to start by reading it. This game is really good!!.. so help me please! Thanks in advance!
I think the most important is to understand readiness concept. The first thing I did was reading of manual couple of times. Then I marked every mention of readiness loss and readiness gain. In opposite, production is IMHO the last thing to mess with. The best way to learn how to play is to play the game for Germans in 1941 and post your questions here in forum which is pretty alive and you'll probably get the complete answer almost immediately. Manual is obsolete due to many changes which were made in last versions, but it is enough to understand game basics.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 56
Two best discussions on game play are these threads:
What's important? by Rundstedt
Startegies and Tactics by Kuniworth
Two best discussions on game play are these threads:
What's important? by Rundstedt
Startegies and Tactics by Kuniworth
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 55
More players joining with questions.
Two threads:
Appearance of German Weapons started by Rundstedt, contains some hints on plotting.
Some Questions by Micha, formula for Italian front collapsing.
More players joining with questions.
Two threads:
Appearance of German Weapons started by Rundstedt, contains some hints on plotting.
Some Questions by Micha, formula for Italian front collapsing.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 54
Complaints about some players using tactics which exploit bugs in pbem.
A short thread on Airplane Interdiction Mission by crazy_horse007 is interesting.
Best thread is: Panzer Korps....should have at least 1 PZ div by Muzrub.
Since this is still V3.0 some of the items/bugs discussed may be corrected in later updates.
Complaints about some players using tactics which exploit bugs in pbem.
A short thread on Airplane Interdiction Mission by crazy_horse007 is interesting.
Best thread is: Panzer Korps....should have at least 1 PZ div by Muzrub.
Since this is still V3.0 some of the items/bugs discussed may be corrected in later updates.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 53
More players are understanding the mechanics of the game and issues with various bugs/exploits are surfacing. There are still discussions on historical vs ahistorical gameplay.
No one trusts the AI and it appears everyone micromanages the game, never using Computer Operational Control because of any errors/dumb moves the AI might make.
The play testers mention that the AI code is hard to understand.
Two threads of interest:
Air Power - Axis/Russia by Pantakari
How can I free Pool equippment? by moonfog
More players are understanding the mechanics of the game and issues with various bugs/exploits are surfacing. There are still discussions on historical vs ahistorical gameplay.
No one trusts the AI and it appears everyone micromanages the game, never using Computer Operational Control because of any errors/dumb moves the AI might make.
The play testers mention that the AI code is hard to understand.
Two threads of interest:
Air Power - Axis/Russia by Pantakari
How can I free Pool equippment? by moonfog
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 52
Ver 3.1 released.
Initially problems with some of the original AI bugs re-activated.
Re-released an update shortly later.
Ver 3.1 released.
Initially problems with some of the original AI bugs re-activated.
Re-released an update shortly later.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 51
Complaints about the AI blunders and more players are getting involved with using editwir.
WirHack v2.0 out.
More information on updated calculations for the strengths required on Western and Italian Fronts.
WIR v3.101 released. Things of change include new icons, new maps and colours.
Complaints about the AI blunders and more players are getting involved with using editwir.
WirHack v2.0 out.
More information on updated calculations for the strengths required on Western and Italian Fronts.
WIR v3.101 released. Things of change include new icons, new maps and colours.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 50 and 49
Strong community involvement.
Updated version of Wirhack v2.11 and Editwir.
Possum is making changes to OBwir file.
Players are discovering more anomalies/bugs/inconsistencies.
Strong community involvement.
Updated version of Wirhack v2.11 and Editwir.
Possum is making changes to OBwir file.
Players are discovering more anomalies/bugs/inconsistencies.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
I just realized why there are so many questions from newbies about War in Russia (WIR) and problems with the documentation.
When SSI Gary Grigsby's Second Front (SF) came out the manual included lots of information. Unfortunately, there were undocumented items included in the game. Included at the end of the manual were tables and formulas.
Next, SSI GG West Front (WF) came out. The WF manual included some additional items and dropped some other explanations. The tables and formulas appeared to be identical to SF. The inter-phase also went from keyboard to mouse.
When WIR came out the manual omitted some more items and included other bits of information. The tables and formulas still appear to be the same.
Then from v1.0 to v2.0 there were more changes, some were documented, some not. There was some mention in the forum that also occurred from v2.0 to v3.3.
If you joined the game at v3.0 there are gaps in your knowledge.
So, to gain the most information, read SF and WF manuals as well as WIR manual and the documented updates.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 48
Discussions on the AI, leadership, HQ mules (swapping HQ's so that units remained supplied), more bugs surfacing.
There are more players involved and contributing ideas. PBEM is an ongoing discussion because the AI is not challenging enough. The AI is better on defence than offence and that was also mentioned in SSI's West Front.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 47
Possum discovers that HQ behaviour is hardcoded and cannot be changed.
More new players and everyone is PBEM and discovering bugs.
heiks has mentioned in numerous posts about a player tool he made called WIRAssistant, unfortunately I cannot find any valid link to the program.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 46
More players using WIRedit to check variables in the game.
Three articles with interesting information.
One is on protecting oil fields is about the range of fighters defending against the allied airforce.
The second is about production and changing equiptment types.
The last is about airpower and the difference in casualty rates for cannon vs load.
More players using WIRedit to check variables in the game.
Three articles with interesting information.
One is on protecting oil fields is about the range of fighters defending against the allied airforce.
The second is about production and changing equiptment types.
The last is about airpower and the difference in casualty rates for cannon vs load.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 45
Some discussion on players using Possum's WIR and Mist's WIR scenarios.
Two good threads:
One is a exploiting a bug using a technique to increase Soviet aircraft experience.
Second is a good discussion on Soviet strategy.
Some discussion on players using Possum's WIR and Mist's WIR scenarios.
Two good threads:
One is a exploiting a bug using a technique to increase Soviet aircraft experience.
Second is a good discussion on Soviet strategy.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 44
Thread on HQ's and OP's has an explanation on replacement HQ's and the need to adjust their standard replacement rate from 0 (zero).
AAR on a scenario called Great Patriotic War.
Thread on HQ's and OP's has an explanation on replacement HQ's and the need to adjust their standard replacement rate from 0 (zero).
AAR on a scenario called Great Patriotic War.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 43
New WIR v3.2
Production is the main change.
New WIRHack v3.2
New WIR v3.2
Production is the main change.
New WIRHack v3.2
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 42
Possum is coming out with V5
Thread about HQ Range has an interesting bit of info.
Also the thread called "My impressions of the updated version" is a good read.
Possum is coming out with V5
Thread about HQ Range has an interesting bit of info.
Also the thread called "My impressions of the updated version" is a good read.
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Page 41
Rich Dionne has revised the icons.
Not much else.
Computer Gaming World in issue 5.1 and 5.2 has an article on WIR.
http://www.cgwmuseum.org/galleries/issues/cgw_5.1.pdf
http://www.cgwmuseum.org/galleries/issues/cgw_5.2.pdf
This part of the article I found interesting. It seems that during the pulse turn the AI can move the other player's unit before your plot takes effect.
Trenches and initiative; these are the two
concepts of WIR which have made lasting
impressions. You may remember that the
first installment of our story ended with a
German advance of two hexes by an armored
unit to a spot northwest of Voronezh.
I also had an infantry unit advance one hex
so that the armor was in contact with the rest
of my forces. Well, on Turn Five, the computer
made Kirk the "first player" in the tactical
movement segment. (Each turn, there
is a 5-10% chance that the Russians will
move first in the turn, with the chance increasing
as the war progresses). Turn Five
just happened to be one which was selected,
and so Kirk's forces were moved first. He attacked
the infantry unit behind my armor
and forced it to retreat; this put my armor out
of supply and isolated. Further, I had plotted
a one hex retreat for my armor to join the infantry
unit, as I felt that the armor was too
exposed and wanted to reinforce the infantry
behind it. Instead of joining my infantry,
my armor unit found itself attacking the Russians
which had just cut it off. The attach
was resolved at one-to-one odds and, of
course, did not move the Russians; this was
not at all how I had planned for things to go
on this turn! I am not sure what can be done
about the initiative question, I guess that the
moral is just that the Russians will be given
the first move only whenever it can do you
the most harm (this was the only turn in our
game for which they received the first move).
Rich Dionne has revised the icons.
Not much else.
Computer Gaming World in issue 5.1 and 5.2 has an article on WIR.
http://www.cgwmuseum.org/galleries/issues/cgw_5.1.pdf
http://www.cgwmuseum.org/galleries/issues/cgw_5.2.pdf
This part of the article I found interesting. It seems that during the pulse turn the AI can move the other player's unit before your plot takes effect.
Trenches and initiative; these are the two
concepts of WIR which have made lasting
impressions. You may remember that the
first installment of our story ended with a
German advance of two hexes by an armored
unit to a spot northwest of Voronezh.
I also had an infantry unit advance one hex
so that the armor was in contact with the rest
of my forces. Well, on Turn Five, the computer
made Kirk the "first player" in the tactical
movement segment. (Each turn, there
is a 5-10% chance that the Russians will
move first in the turn, with the chance increasing
as the war progresses). Turn Five
just happened to be one which was selected,
and so Kirk's forces were moved first. He attacked
the infantry unit behind my armor
and forced it to retreat; this put my armor out
of supply and isolated. Further, I had plotted
a one hex retreat for my armor to join the infantry
unit, as I felt that the armor was too
exposed and wanted to reinforce the infantry
behind it. Instead of joining my infantry,
my armor unit found itself attacking the Russians
which had just cut it off. The attach
was resolved at one-to-one odds and, of
course, did not move the Russians; this was
not at all how I had planned for things to go
on this turn! I am not sure what can be done
about the initiative question, I guess that the
moral is just that the Russians will be given
the first move only whenever it can do you
the most harm (this was the only turn in our
game for which they received the first move).
- Rasputitsa
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- Contact:
RE: Re-reading the old posts
Good find, I started playing WIR with this very first version (shown in the CGW link), in the mid 80s, cost over 80GBP in those days. The graphics were so primitive and it could only be played on a B&W screen, as it was US format. I made up a map on a blank hex sheet and played with AH 'Third Reich' counters.
Great times. [:)]
I still remember the shock of losing the 24th Pz Korps, the most powerful unit on the board, in the first winter,
Great times. [:)]
I still remember the shock of losing the 24th Pz Korps, the most powerful unit on the board, in the first winter,
"In politics stupidity is not a handicap" - Napoleon
“A people which is able to say everything becomes able to do everything” - Napoleon
“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress" - Napoleon
“A people which is able to say everything becomes able to do everything” - Napoleon
“Among those who dislike oppression are many who like to oppress" - Napoleon