Alligator

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

I can only assume something has got lost in the translation....

Not really.

Just because an experiment works 3 times in a row does not mean it will work on the fourth try...

These persons are socially dangerous, as they might encourage the impressionable ones, you know, the Darwin Award contestants. That's the real problem with these guys...

warspite1

Yes really. I was answering a question and giving an example to support. I'm not talking about dangerous experiments being remarkable or whether someone is a danger to the impressionable public.

[Greybriar]

This was a tragic incident. But who is more to blame, the Disney people or the parents?

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

This was a tragic incident. But who is more to blame, the Disney people or the parents?

warspite1

If there were no warnings of alligators then Disney have to take the blame.

Of course one can ask why a child so young is in the water, seemingly alone, at night, when there are 'No Swimming' signs all over the place and who knows what is in the water and whether the lagoon bed is rocky or sandy (and thus easy for him to lose his footing). However, given that the poor child is dead, there is no blame, no punishment, no sanction, that 'we' can levy on the parents that will make them feel worse than they do. For any mistake they have made, they have paid in the worst way imaginable.

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

This was a tragic incident. But who is more to blame, the Disney people or the parents?

warspite1

If there were no warnings of alligators then Disney have to take the blame.

Of course one can ask why a child so young is in the water, seemingly alone, at night, when there are 'No Swimming' signs all over the place and who knows what is in the water and whether the lagoon bed is rocky or sandy (and thus easy for him to lose his footing). However, given that the poor child is dead, there is no blame, no punishment, no sanction, that 'we' can levy on the parents that will make them feel worse than they do. For any mistake they have made, they have paid in the worst way imaginable.

Well said. Pretty much sums it up.

[Lecivius]

I don't think there is any blame to be laid. It was a horrible accident of nature. A perfect storm, as is mentioned on CNN. Consider. There are also cottonmouths in the area. Snapping turtles. Dangerous spiders. Even bull sharks, fer crimmeny sakes. Where do you draw the line?

If the gator had been in an enclosure, sure. But blaming Disney is akin to blaming the government of Tanzania for a tourist getting attacked by a rogue lion on the Serengeti. Or India for an attack by a rogue tiger in the back bush. It was a sad, and a horrible, accident.

[warspite1]

I take your point but I think an attack at a Disney "beach resort" is different from being in the Serengetti. If there were no signs to remind people (or indeed inform them) that there could be alligators in the lagoon then I think that is wrong. Sure, there were 'No Swimming' signs but humans being what they are - and unaware of the potential danger - going into the water cannot be discounted.

[british exil]

I was 10 when my brother, who was 9, drowned. That was 1981.

My mum and dad still suffer. My mum has not once visited the grave of my brother,since the funeral.My brothers death and burial is the only reason why we stayed here in Germany,the cemetery being near Hanover Germany. Dad was in the BAoR at the time, so we did not live close to the military cemetery.My mum had the desire to still be near him. It is something we do not talk much about, it hurts my parents so much. It took me years to find the cemetery, as I had no one to ask for precise information. The sad thing is I can hardly remember my brother, only a few memories come to my memory. Some days more than others.

I know for sure my parents will never forget him. Reading such reports and being a dad now, really hurts, knowing what pain my parents go through every day.

Losing a child is something so painful and the wounds never heal.

Mat

[Mobeer]

ORIGINAL: warspite1
...Of course one can ask why a child so young is in the water, seemingly alone, at night, when there are 'No Swimming' signs all over the place and who knows what is in the water and whether the lagoon bed is rocky or sandy (and thus easy for him to lose his footing). However...

In fairness to his parents, the boy was not swimming, and his dad was close enough to be injured trying to retrieve his son.

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: Mobeer

ORIGINAL: warspite1
...Of course one can ask why a child so young is in the water, seemingly alone, at night, when there are 'No Swimming' signs all over the place and who knows what is in the water and whether the lagoon bed is rocky or sandy (and thus easy for him to lose his footing). However...

In fairness to his parents, the boy was not swimming, and his dad was close enough to be injured trying to retrieve his son.

warspite1

I think that is splitting hairs but, given what I said in post 23 (and given Mat's personal story above), I have no intention of commenting on the parents actions further.

[Lecivius]

I won’t post after this, as I don’t wish to start an argument over a tradgedy. And I do realize you understand my point of view, and I do respect your opinion. However, this was not a beach resort. It was a resort hotel with a lagoon. And gators, snakes, spiders, ugly turtles, sharks, and other nasty’s are all indigenous to this area. It’s going to have to be a REALLY big sign.

In any event, maybe we need to post shark warnings along beachfront hotels along the Great Lakes?
https://retrieverman.net/tag/bull-shark-lake-michigan/

Hotels in Colorado post warnings along trails warning about rattlesnakes? I see snakes every year in town on local trails, never seen a sign.
http://denver.cbslocal.com/2016/05/30/h ... -colorado/

Why do the hotels in California or Hawaii only post signs after a shark has been sighted?
http://hawaiitribune-herald.com/news/na ... rnia-beach

For that matter, Florida is the 5th most dangerous state in the United States, a fact I did not know until I started poking around. Perhaps we should blame the local tourist bureau? Sorry, I realize I’m being a bit pompous, I just don’t see blaming Disney in this. I would if I could; I am no fan of large corporate America. But not in this. My heart just breaks for the family. They will never be whole again.

[Greybriar]

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

This was a tragic incident. But who is more to blame, the Disney people or the parents?

warspite1

If there were no warnings of alligators then Disney have to take the blame.

Of course one can ask why a child so young is in the water, seemingly alone, at night, when there are 'No Swimming' signs all over the place and who knows what is in the water and whether the lagoon bed is rocky or sandy (and thus easy for him to lose his footing). However, given that the poor child is dead, there is no blame, no punishment, no sanction, that 'we' can levy on the parents that will make them feel worse than they do. For any mistake they have made, they have paid in the worst way imaginable.

At two years of age, a child should not be unsupervised. Period.

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

This was a tragic incident. But who is more to blame, the Disney people or the parents?

warspite1

If there were no warnings of alligators then Disney have to take the blame.

Of course one can ask why a child so young is in the water, seemingly alone, at night, when there are 'No Swimming' signs all over the place and who knows what is in the water and whether the lagoon bed is rocky or sandy (and thus easy for him to lose his footing). However, given that the poor child is dead, there is no blame, no punishment, no sanction, that 'we' can levy on the parents that will make them feel worse than they do. For any mistake they have made, they have paid in the worst way imaginable.

At two years of age, a child should not be unsupervised. Period.

Sounds like good advice. Though, apparently the father was close enough to wrestle with the gator when the attack occurred. All in all, given various circumstances, it maybe could have happened to almost anyone who was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Young children sometimes do rash things and go chase after whatever fantastical ideations possess them at the spur of the moment. In some senses maybe no one is to blame, however, since it was on Disney property it might be wise for Disney to take greater precaution in the future on behalf of their guests.

[Jim D Burns]

ORIGINAL: Greybriar
At two years of age, a child should not be unsupervised. Period.

The father was very nearby, it would be an injustice to say the child was unsupervised. No one is to blame here it's simply mother nature taking its natural course.

Our civilization has become so advanced we forget we are not the top of the food chain on this planet and when we get reminded of it as happened here, it's natural to want to attach blame. It helps to convince ourselves we are the masters of nature and someone must have done something wrong for something like this to occur.

There are many things in nature lethal to us and sometimes we get zapped, there is no blame to be placed other than on mother nature itself.

Jim

[Greybriar]

If the father (and mother) were properly parenting, their two-year-old son would not have been in the water in the first place.

It is a tragic event and I am certain the parents are grieving the loss of their son, but they have only themselves to blame.

[british exil]

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

If the father (and mother) were properly parenting, their two-year-old son would not have been in the water in the first place.

It is a tragic event and I am certain the parents are grieving the loss of their son, but they have only themselves to blame.

Tragic is nowhere near the situation. You mourn when a grandparent or at a certain age a parent dies. That is Period.
When a young child dies, no matter in which way, the parent will want to change places.

They might be wondering if it was their fault for booking a wonderful holiday. Should they stayed at home. Whose idea was it to travel. If they are even able to think clearly.
I know from first hand experience what my parents said. I had no way of sharing their real pain. Not even able to comprehend how they felt. My mum would break down in tears years after. My dad, as I learnt later, would cry in private.

Blurting out such a comment as mentioned above is from someone who has never and fortunately experienced such a life changing event.
I will put it plainly, a stupid statement.

Mat


I do not want to start an argument. But it really hurts me when I read such posts.

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

If the father (and mother) were properly parenting, their two-year-old son would not have been in the water in the first place.

It is a tragic event and I am certain the parents are grieving the loss of their son, but they have only themselves to blame.

Do we know enough about the circumstances to conclude that the parents weren't "properly parenting"? Did the signs say "no swimming" or did they say "stay out of the water"? If the child was simply standing in the water and not swimming and the signs said "no swimming", then technically they maybe weren't doing anything wrong.

[GaryChildress]

ORIGINAL: british exil

ORIGINAL: Greybriar

If the father (and mother) were properly parenting, their two-year-old son would not have been in the water in the first place.

It is a tragic event and I am certain the parents are grieving the loss of their son, but they have only themselves to blame.

Tragic is nowhere near the situation. You mourn when a grandparent or at a certain age a parent dies. That is Period.
When a young child dies, no matter in which way, the parent will want to change places.

They might be wondering if it was their fault for booking a wonderful holiday. Should they stayed at home. Whose idea was it to travel. If they are even able to think clearly.
I know from first hand experience what my parents said. I had no way of sharing their real pain. Not even able to comprehend how they felt. My mum would break down in tears years after. My dad, as I learnt later, would cry in private.

Blurting out such a comment as mentioned above is from someone who has never and fortunately experienced such a life changing event.
I will put it plainly, a stupid statement.

Mat


I do not want to start an argument. But it really hurts me when I read such posts.

Well said, british exil. Just now saw your comment and think this says it all.

[TulliusDetritus]

ORIGINAL: british exil

Tragic is nowhere near the situation. You mourn when a grandparent or at a certain age a parent dies. That is Period.

Exactly. A parent should never bury a son / daughter. Never.

[Orm]

Could we, please, try to avoid to lay blame in regards of this tragic event. I find it sad enough without it. [:(]

[Zap]

When our society can't except that there are accidents where no blame can be pointed at any party. It has a lot to do with a litigious society. Making someone responsible so they can pay. There are still grey areas where no one is to blame. This is on of them a tragic accident. t