Hell bent on Lebensraum IV

[Michael T]

If you look at this:

tm.asp?m=3048697

You will see what I try to do on T3. I mostly always divert AGN mech units to AGC if I can secure a good breakthru on T3 in the centre. That was/is the intent. And to achieve that you must have your AGN mech units where I have them now. I am not saying I *will* get thru in the Centre on T3 this time round. Maybe I won't have enough fuel. Maybe he will flood it with units. I also have a bad feeling about my 41st PzHQ. If it gets over run by some sneaky Russians hiding in a pocket that I missed then my AGN Mech won't be going anywhere. And the reason I may have missed it is a lack of ID up front to run thru and secure rear area's due to the leaks in turn one. This is the compounding price you pay for early mistakes. Minimizing mistakes usually is my forte. But I am still very rusty.

[A game]

Thanks MT, good to see a different strategy, I think the standard for AGN is to just rush the Velikaya at full speed on turn 2 and push for Leningrad as hard as possible, I know I do this as I hate to let the Soviets get too dug in around Lgrad.

Im also obsessed with Riga as one of my very first PvP games I left it on turn one and then it became a giant pain in the ass to take later on!

I think you have highlighted one of the hardest things with playing the Germans, any mistakes, even tiny mistakes can snowball from the first few turns and then derail the game if you are playing a good Soviet player. The Soviet side is far more forgiving of mistakes as its built into the system that you will lose units.

Another question: what are your air settings for 41? I have completely forgotten the standard settings, as I was never that interested in the air war anyway.

[Michael T]

The air war has changed a lot. The Luftwaffe is now a powerful weapon. It makes me shudder what the Soviet VVS is going to be capable of in 1943 and beyond. But I am still tinkering with the settings, so I have no formula yet. But I believe you need to max out the interception settings. Stuka's can cause a lot of carnage now.

[Michael T]

More examples of what my intent is:

tm.asp?m=3268003&mpage=1&key=

tm.asp?m=3285819&mpage=1&key=

tm.asp?m=3108453

You can see from all these that the weight of Pz4 is always more in support of the northern flank of AGC rather than a direct run for Leningrad. The drive for Leningrad comes later after the back of the Russian Army is broken between Smolensk and Moscow. The T3 breakthru past the land bridge is always evident.

Such fond memories. But the game has changed so much since then. So said plan may not work anymore. But for my first game back in over 2.5 years I figured I would try a strategy I know well.

[VigaBrand]

Nice to hear that.
Pelton was long, long time the best axis player in this forum, so most people try to copy him.
Pelton drives in every game in the last two hours always dircet to Leningrad. His strategy was to help Panzergruppe 4 with a corps from PzGr 3 and so everybody focus on that.
It is nice to see some player with another strategy and your reputation helps you. Without that reputation you will more often hear how bad your opening is.
So I'm interested and see a nice approach.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: Michael T

You can see from all these that the weight of Pz4 is always more in support of the northern flank of AGC rather than a direct run for Leningrad. The drive for Leningrad comes later after the back of the Russian Army is broken between Smolensk and Moscow. The T3 breakthru past the land bridge is always evident.

Such fond memories. But the game has changed so much since then. So said plan may not work anymore. But for my first game back in over 2.5 years I figured I would try a strategy I know well.

Supply chain in the Center is going to dictate your speed of advance. Soviets still has the luxury of space for time keeping you on that tether for a some turns while your supply & infantry plays catch up in the Center. Also turn 2 your infantry is still mopping up units and on turn 3 those units will still be mopping up. I personally make it a point of having all pockets eliminated turn 2 (except the Lvov Pocket which takes a bit) and those infantry moving forward.

[Michael T]

End German T3 - 3rd July 1941 (Clear)

In the north slow progress as we try to right the ship. As I thought might happen the Reds cut two of my Mech units from their parent HQ so very little fuel available for them which significantly weakened my 4th PG support for AGC. Small gain made toward Pskov as the ID try to catch up.

Things go fairly well in the AGC. With some support from 4th PG we manage to push through the land bridge and create a nice pocket centred on Vitebsk, 8 ID all up.

In the south the Vinnitsa pocket held. The ring around it tightens with infantry. The panzers dash to east thru a huge gap.

[ericv]

any news here?

[Michael T]

I just finished my T4 about 30 minutes ago. Will post a new map tomorrow. David had a busy week.

[Michael T]

End German T4 10th July 1941 (Clear)

Not a lot happened this turn. Lack of fuel putting the brakes on in most area’s. Though progress was still made here and there. I am only just coming to grips with the nuances of how to operate an efficient re-fuelling system just now.

In AGN we inch toward Pskov. Some of the Mech units diverted to supporting AGC return and we should be able to make more progress north next turn if they get gas.

In AGC a flood of Soviet full strength ID pour in an around our penetration up the land bridge. A lack of fuel and infantry support limits our advance to pushing past Smolensk and hooking south to establish a substantial bridgehead across the Dnepr. The enemy must now surely pull back from his entrenched positions to the south and west of Smolensk or risk destruction. A small encirclement in the swamplands traps the last of the fleeing Soviets from the initial border battles.

In AGS the fuel situation is very bad. I lack the AP to do any HQBU on this front so we do the best we can. We continue to reduce the pockets and slowly creep up to the Dnepr in several places to keep the enemy guessing where we might attempt to cross it. We have some infantry in position to help out.

Overall things are still okish. I need to regain the momentum again in the Centre. I am surprised at the strength of the Soviet ID in and around Smolensk. They seem to get too strong to quickly still and refuse to break. I am fairly confident I could still construct and Iron wall with them.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

I am fairly confident I could still construct and Iron wall with them.

You can and people do all the time. 40-60 point defense hexes, but I love people that do this early game. Nothing is more gratifying than to punch a hole through and surround these large stacks. Because normally these are the better units the Soviets have. After a few turns doing this there is no more wall & the soviets are scrambling for units when they need all they can get early game.

[Michael T]

They don't make it right.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: Michael T

They don't make it right.

I concur that many don't know how. But even the few that do know how to build correctly the Germans can still punish this type of defense in 41

[Michael T]

These dudes you have been punishing, anyone I know?

[Manstein63]

It will be the reserve activation's that will hurt you. SF is very good at maintaining a high level of reserve activation & it can be quite frustrating to see an attack go in with 3 to 1 odds or better only to see the final result come in at 1.99 to 1. You will be forced to make deliberate attacks that will eat into your movement points & will possibly slow any further forward momentum. Also the loss of FBD 5 until 1942 really can hurt the German player in the Ukraine unless he is very careful.
Manstein63

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: Michael T

These dudes you have been punishing, anyone I know?

Didn't say anything about punishing dudes ;-P Only mentioned the defense in 41 could be punished.

[Michael T]

I can punish a defense of a novice quite easily. But a Flavius or some other proven vet would be a different matter. My point is the 'Iron Wall' that is established by a top liner is still going to be a rather tough problem to overcome I fear. However time will tell when I have to face a vet German myself.

[Michael T]

End German T5 17th July 1941 (Clear)

AGN

Some momentum starting to build on this front at last. 4 Divisions cut off in a small pocket centred on Pskov. Fuel looking good for the Mech units to keep pushing next turn.

AGC

Some really nice work here. I deliberated long and hard weather to strike north, south or east. In the end we opt for a surge north-east. I large pocket is locked down. Maybe 25+ divisions trapped. Moscow looks attainable before October.

AGS

I have to admit progress is slow here. But we are finally ready to cross the Dnepr next turn. Infantry is ready, Mech units gassed up and well rested. We have trapped a few divisions on the west bank so if he runs there will be some consolation POW’s.

Overall progress is picking up speed. The slow progress in the south is the price for the excellent progress in AGC.

[Michael T]

Close up the pocket east of Rzhev

[Michael T]

At this point I received the resignation of sillyflower. David said his losses made the game a forgone conclusion. I knew he must have been hurting but his resignation came as a surprise. I figured by turn 8 or 9 he would be in a lot of trouble. I have the utmost respect for him so I accept his judgement.

I had hoped for a return game where we swap sides under the same conditions. But it looks like David is not keen on that ATM.