A date with 08.
Moderators: Joel Billings, Sabre21
A date with 08.
Kelblau requested a game with mild blizzard and no plus 1. Amazingly, it was still on the board a day later.
This is the same as his current AAR against Herman. I am very interested in the mechanics of .08 so this will be a very technical AAR focus on game minutia. Because of the the rules concessions, I will play the campaign straight up with no house rules and no deep Lvov opening. Kelblau is welcome to review and comment.
The AAR opens with the heroic efforts of the Romanian 3rd Army tactical bombers against the mass of Soviet fighters at Stanislav.
This is the same as his current AAR against Herman. I am very interested in the mechanics of .08 so this will be a very technical AAR focus on game minutia. Because of the the rules concessions, I will play the campaign straight up with no house rules and no deep Lvov opening. Kelblau is welcome to review and comment.
The AAR opens with the heroic efforts of the Romanian 3rd Army tactical bombers against the mass of Soviet fighters at Stanislav.
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RE: A date with 08.
The commander of Stanislav IAD airbase is a traitor. He will be shot.
Good luck rmonical!
I'm getting ready for the onslaught.
Good luck rmonical!
I'm getting ready for the onslaught.
Kein Operationsplan reicht mit einiger Sicherheit
über das erste Zusammentreffen
mit der feindlichen Hauptmacht hinaus.
über das erste Zusammentreffen
mit der feindlichen Hauptmacht hinaus.
RE: A date with 08.
I then repeated the experiment with the two 4th Army air units, they started at only 16/2. The stopped flying airbase missions after 8 sorties ending the opening at 14/4 and 20 something-ish fatigue. I do not know why they stopped flying. They claim 246 ground kills. Kishinev says 105/156 and the editor says it started at 403 so the numbers look consistent. I did try a ground bombardment and the remarkable Romanian biplanes were up for more. I gave up on 4th Army alone after another 15 sorties (down to 5 AC flying). 4th Army ends this phase of the turn with 11/6 having lost on aircraft and with 4 of 16 that started flying damaged. Percentage flown is less than 70% and fatigue is 35%. The 4th Army continued to fly in support of the 3rd Army sorties until both were at 100% flown. Fatigue less than 40%. I estimate the 22nd squadron flew over 40 sorties. The 3rd Army units were still causing ground casualties after more than 40 sorties on the week but were down to 7% ammunition.
I'm not going say much more about bombardment. I love the new rule. I plan to not abuse it in this game, but I think the fatigue and supply models need work. I made this point in a post based on my solo play, A Russian player noted 10K killed a week in 1943. I noticed the German Stukas flew a lot less in blizzard. In this case, miles piled up faster than in summer. IMHO, fatigue can also play a role in unit effectiveness. For example, morale is reduced by some fraction of the fatigue.
By the time they were finished, the Romanians had killed 990 AC.
I'm not going say much more about bombardment. I love the new rule. I plan to not abuse it in this game, but I think the fatigue and supply models need work. I made this point in a post based on my solo play, A Russian player noted 10K killed a week in 1943. I noticed the German Stukas flew a lot less in blizzard. In this case, miles piled up faster than in summer. IMHO, fatigue can also play a role in unit effectiveness. For example, morale is reduced by some fraction of the fatigue.
By the time they were finished, the Romanians had killed 990 AC.
RE: A date with 08.
It gets worse [:D]ORIGINAL: Kelblau
The commander of Stanislav IAD airbase is a traitor. He will be shot.
Good luck rmonical!
I'm getting ready for the onslaught.
RE: A date with 08.
I am a pathetic worthless scum-sucking liar. After promising not to belabor the point, I decided to belabor the point. After all, if I am going to abuse the new bombardment rule, the time to do it is against a bunch of units that are going to die anyway. So the air forces that killed almost 5000 AC also killed about another 2500 in bombardment alone. Most air groups are available for additional bombardment and air support. The Soviets started the bombardment phase with 400 some odd air defense casualties.
Remember - I love the new rule and I only hope we can tweak it in.
Remember - I love the new rule and I only hope we can tweak it in.
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RE: A date with 08.
I think the development of pockets in AGS is one of the more interesting elements of the campaign. Especially if one passes on the more extreme openings. This is the initial move of the XXIV Panzer corps and the excellent work of the 41st tank division surviving its three battles. As I first met the 41st division I called on the Luftwaffe to help soften it up and it delivered.
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RE: A date with 08.
I love that the Stuka's can now actually wreak havoc.
RE: A date with 08.
We are up to T3. I'll have more macro comments in a day or two. David (Sillyflower) advised us to pay attention to ZOC in a retreat. Higher casualties if they retreat through your ZOC. This is an example with a Soviet mountain division, so perhaps not the best example. I'll find another.
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RE: A date with 08.
The early entry of the Soviets into Hungry confirms their offensive intent. With the German mountain divisions in pursuit, they soon ran out of mountain and pushed through to the lowlands where the Hungarian mobile corps awaited.
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RE: A date with 08.
This is the situation at the of T3:
North:
North:
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RE: A date with 08.
Wow. I usually see results like this when the defender is in a swamp.
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RE: A date with 08.
And another one. Two rifle divisions are already almost Guards eligible. I hate swamps. For some reason I did not check. I could have sent in Totenkopf earlier.
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RE: A date with 08.
T7 - Finland is winding down - he is retreating back to the no retreat line. We pocketed two divisions.
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RE: A date with 08.
On the approach to Leningrad I created a small pocket on T4. Reduced it on T5, Rested on T6 because I did not like my fuel situation. This is the ending situation on T7.
The fuel tanks are almost bone dry. I flew the LW a lot and those level bombers burn a lot of fuel:
Three Panzer corps went through 1800 tons of fuel in intense combat. A few hundred tons of ammunition.
The Luftwaffe went through 5300 tons of fuel and 5900 tons of ammunition.
So the Germans cannot fly so much. This begs the question what is wrong with the attrition model because if I don't fly them, the Ju 88s and He111s build up in the pool.
The fuel tanks are almost bone dry. I flew the LW a lot and those level bombers burn a lot of fuel:
Three Panzer corps went through 1800 tons of fuel in intense combat. A few hundred tons of ammunition.
The Luftwaffe went through 5300 tons of fuel and 5900 tons of ammunition.
So the Germans cannot fly so much. This begs the question what is wrong with the attrition model because if I don't fly them, the Ju 88s and He111s build up in the pool.
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RE: A date with 08.
In AGC, on T6 I made the incursions shown. On left is the at start situation and on right, the end of turn. As you can see, we could get the breakthrough, but with two corp missing and not that much fuel, it is all we could do. A lot of units routed here. I hope it means a softer defense on the next defense line. After understanding the fuel and usage numbers in the north, I used the level bombers a lot less in the center. Let's see if the panzers get any gas next week.
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RE: A date with 08.
This is the situation at the beginning of T5 in AGS.
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RE: A date with 08.
End of T6. So far, the infantry has not been able to engage as it has in the North and in the Center.
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RE: A date with 08.
And the end of T7. Odessa just had a security regiment and has fallen. It will be interesting to see what happens. Again, the Mobile forces were in the 35 MP range.
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RE: A date with 08.
Statistics as of the end of T7
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