RKhan vs thedrillsgt, Part 2 (Done - Soviet Victory T25)
Moderators: Joel Billings, Sabre21
RKhan vs thedrillsgt, Part 2 (Done - Soviet Victory T25)
Having brought my first AAR discussing 2 noobs bumbling about and learning the game the hard way to a logical conclusion, I have decided to continue the story in a new AAR. Part 1 can be found here for those that have an interest: tm.asp?m=4011845
For Part 2 I want to focus on strategy and tactics from the Soviet side. I'm picking this up from the first mud season in 1941. My conclusion from Part 1 was that the Soviets are doing well, as would be expected with 2 new players. Therefore I will set the bar for myself rather high. I plan to get through the end of 1942 without losing Leningrad, Moscow or Stalingrad. I expect the first of these to be especially tough as Leningrad is open to capture as we pick up the thread again...
For Part 2 I want to focus on strategy and tactics from the Soviet side. I'm picking this up from the first mud season in 1941. My conclusion from Part 1 was that the Soviets are doing well, as would be expected with 2 new players. Therefore I will set the bar for myself rather high. I plan to get through the end of 1942 without losing Leningrad, Moscow or Stalingrad. I expect the first of these to be especially tough as Leningrad is open to capture as we pick up the thread again...
RKhan
Turn 18: Setting the Stage
Picking up on Turn 18 with the situation across the front, starting in the north: (all mud btw)
There are still strong mobile forces situated in the north and well east of Leningrad. Keeping these from driving straight north to capture my supply ports will be difficult.
Also, he has strong infantry poised to push directly into the city.
The sensible thing for him to do is retreat the mobile units a bit and stock up on supplies and petrol for a mad dash once the snow comes. Or, he could try to expand the pocket enough to let supplies in without giving up ground but this is a bit more tricky.
For my part, I need strong forces here but not at the expense of other fronts. I will start railing these in and wait to see what approach my opponent takes before forming a firm battle plan.
There are still strong mobile forces situated in the north and well east of Leningrad. Keeping these from driving straight north to capture my supply ports will be difficult.
Also, he has strong infantry poised to push directly into the city.
The sensible thing for him to do is retreat the mobile units a bit and stock up on supplies and petrol for a mad dash once the snow comes. Or, he could try to expand the pocket enough to let supplies in without giving up ground but this is a bit more tricky.
For my part, I need strong forces here but not at the expense of other fronts. I will start railing these in and wait to see what approach my opponent takes before forming a firm battle plan.
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RKhan
Turn 18: Setting the Stage
Turn 18 Center
My situation in the center is rather exposed. One good push and I could lose all of Western Front (the blue ones for fellow noobs). Only the mud is saving me right now.
Again, I don't know if he will withdraw or expand his spearheads during mud. In the short term I will get back across the river with Western Front and wait on a firm approach.
My situation in the center is rather exposed. One good push and I could lose all of Western Front (the blue ones for fellow noobs). Only the mud is saving me right now.
Again, I don't know if he will withdraw or expand his spearheads during mud. In the short term I will get back across the river with Western Front and wait on a firm approach.
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RKhan
Turn 18: Setting the Stage
Turn 18: The South
I final drive by the Germans before the mud season has left spearheads deeply embedded in my troops. I think this is probably not the best plan on his part: all of the mobile forces ought to have pushed from north of D town rather than being split. The southern most spearhead is operationally constrained by the nearby sea and the northern spearhead is not strong enough.
Napoleon says "never interrupt your opponent when he is making a mistake." This summarises my plan for now. I will sacrifice a part of Southwestern Front and Southern Front to keep him surrounded by my troops while building a defence in depth. I will also build a new, but weaker, army along the coast as enticement.
I final drive by the Germans before the mud season has left spearheads deeply embedded in my troops. I think this is probably not the best plan on his part: all of the mobile forces ought to have pushed from north of D town rather than being split. The southern most spearhead is operationally constrained by the nearby sea and the northern spearhead is not strong enough.
Napoleon says "never interrupt your opponent when he is making a mistake." This summarises my plan for now. I will sacrifice a part of Southwestern Front and Southern Front to keep him surrounded by my troops while building a defence in depth. I will also build a new, but weaker, army along the coast as enticement.
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RKhan
Turn 18: Setting the Stage
Turn 18: The far south
For completeness, the Crimea. I will hold here for now.
For completeness, the Crimea. I will hold here for now.
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RKhan
Turn 18: Setting the Stage
Turn 18: Metrics
Loses: Soviet 2.3m, German 398k
AI: 360
HI: 228
Factories Lost: None
I'm in good shape...
Loses: Soviet 2.3m, German 398k
AI: 360
HI: 228
Factories Lost: None
I'm in good shape...
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RKhan
Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
Turn 22: The north
The mobile units east of Leningrad have decided to largely stay put during the mud. However, an early snow in the north has given thedrillsgt a head start on driving to my ports.
My strategy now is to hold on until blizzard and pinch off the uppity German spearhead. To do that I need strong forces ready to go at the north and south pinch points. That is easy enough on the southern side, but on the north side I risk not being able to stop the German drive unless I reposition 7th Independent Army from the south circle to the north. For now it is better to be safe so I decide to move them.
Just in case he does make it to my ports I position airfields for airhead supply behind Leningrad. It won't help for long, but if he just makes the ports when the blizzard comes perhaps I can break the siege.
I'm also slightly worried he may drive the infantry straight into the city but the best forces I have are already there so not much more can be done.
The mobile units east of Leningrad have decided to largely stay put during the mud. However, an early snow in the north has given thedrillsgt a head start on driving to my ports.
My strategy now is to hold on until blizzard and pinch off the uppity German spearhead. To do that I need strong forces ready to go at the north and south pinch points. That is easy enough on the southern side, but on the north side I risk not being able to stop the German drive unless I reposition 7th Independent Army from the south circle to the north. For now it is better to be safe so I decide to move them.
Just in case he does make it to my ports I position airfields for airhead supply behind Leningrad. It won't help for long, but if he just makes the ports when the blizzard comes perhaps I can break the siege.
I'm also slightly worried he may drive the infantry straight into the city but the best forces I have are already there so not much more can be done.
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RKhan
Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
Turn 22: North after my move. A new army if forming up to fill the void of 7th Independent Army.
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RKhan
Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
Turn 22: Center
Getting the Reserve army around the bend of the panzers pushing south has left Western Front more exposed than I would have liked. Luckily I will just get them all out this turn.
My strategy here is to put the new Crimea Front south of Tula and make a big push once the blizzard hits. I will do the same north of Moscow as well. Although I dream of a grand encirclement on the German scale, I know this is a pipe dream. My hope is that he will need to withdraw a good way from Moscow to cover the flanks.
I'm not worried he will get close to Moscow at this point. Reserve Front has my meanest leaders and they are well dug in, and I'm not playing Pelton (thank goodness) who would probably use his panzer in reserve trick on me (or something worse).
Getting the Reserve army around the bend of the panzers pushing south has left Western Front more exposed than I would have liked. Luckily I will just get them all out this turn.
My strategy here is to put the new Crimea Front south of Tula and make a big push once the blizzard hits. I will do the same north of Moscow as well. Although I dream of a grand encirclement on the German scale, I know this is a pipe dream. My hope is that he will need to withdraw a good way from Moscow to cover the flanks.
I'm not worried he will get close to Moscow at this point. Reserve Front has my meanest leaders and they are well dug in, and I'm not playing Pelton (thank goodness) who would probably use his panzer in reserve trick on me (or something worse).
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RKhan
Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
Turn 22: South
My weak new army bites the dust tying up his mobile units just where I want them. My plan here is a blizzard drive straight to Z town through the weak German allies. I have two cavalry only armies in Southwestern Front who will become corps on 4 December. I also have strong mountain infantry in Southern Front to clear the path.
Transcaucus Front forms up near Rostov to take up the slack as we move forward.
My weak new army bites the dust tying up his mobile units just where I want them. My plan here is a blizzard drive straight to Z town through the weak German allies. I have two cavalry only armies in Southwestern Front who will become corps on 4 December. I also have strong mountain infantry in Southern Front to clear the path.
Transcaucus Front forms up near Rostov to take up the slack as we move forward.
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RKhan
Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
Turn 22 Grand Strategy
My overall plan is to use my strong manpower position to bleed the Germans everywhere over the Winter. Given the new retreat rules that is likely to hurt me a lot more than I would like, but being passive is not in my nature (I really ought to play German).
This implies a push everywhere but especially where I have set out above. Hopefully I will create a fair number of Guards in the process without taking too big a morale hit for lost battles.
I will also keep my airforce in the air, bombing airfields if nothing else.
I'm considering a sneaky amphibious attack out of the Crimea as a diversion. The risk of attacking everywhere is losing everywhere. However, a strong Soviet push may also spook a new German player into retreating more than needed. And I can afford it for now.
Go big or go home.
My overall plan is to use my strong manpower position to bleed the Germans everywhere over the Winter. Given the new retreat rules that is likely to hurt me a lot more than I would like, but being passive is not in my nature (I really ought to play German).
This implies a push everywhere but especially where I have set out above. Hopefully I will create a fair number of Guards in the process without taking too big a morale hit for lost battles.
I will also keep my airforce in the air, bombing airfields if nothing else.
I'm considering a sneaky amphibious attack out of the Crimea as a diversion. The risk of attacking everywhere is losing everywhere. However, a strong Soviet push may also spook a new German player into retreating more than needed. And I can afford it for now.
Go big or go home.
RKhan
- sillyflower
- Posts: 3509
- Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 4:39 pm
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RE: Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
Mild or full fat blizzard option? If mild, then you can expect to lose 3 or 4 times G losses in combat under the current patch.
L'grad - I advise you to max out defences on the north side of the river in case he clears the south bank in '41 or '42. If you hold in '41 and push him back a bit in the blizzard, he won't get it in '42. Can't see him getting near Moscow or S.grad either given that you will be very strong in '42. He will only be able to go after 1 of your key 3 cities and that can be blocked. If he goes for 2 or more, he will fail everywhere. Frankly, something will have had to go badly wrong if he even takes the Donbass cities ( Stalino etc) in '42.
L'grad - I advise you to max out defences on the north side of the river in case he clears the south bank in '41 or '42. If you hold in '41 and push him back a bit in the blizzard, he won't get it in '42. Can't see him getting near Moscow or S.grad either given that you will be very strong in '42. He will only be able to go after 1 of your key 3 cities and that can be blocked. If he goes for 2 or more, he will fail everywhere. Frankly, something will have had to go badly wrong if he even takes the Donbass cities ( Stalino etc) in '42.
web exchange
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Post: I am always fearful that when I put this game down on the table and people see the box-art they will think I am some kind of neo-Nazi
Reply: They already know you're a gamer. What other shame can possibly compare?
RE: Turn 22: Setting a Strategy
ORIGINAL: sillyflower
Mild or full fat blizzard option? If mild, then you can expect to lose 3 or 4 times G losses in combat under the current patch.
L'grad - I advise you to max out defences on the north side of the river in case he clears the south bank in '41 or '42. If you hold in '41 and push him back a bit in the blizzard, he won't get it in '42. Can't see him getting near Moscow or S.grad either given that you will be very strong in '42. He will only be able to go after 1 of your key 3 cities and that can be blocked. If he goes for 2 or more, he will fail everywhere. Frankly, something will have had to go badly wrong if he even takes the Donbass cities ( Stalino etc) in '42.
Mild winter and no bonuses for me.
My Leningrad strategy is very aggressive. I'm uncomfortable with how many troops are between his infantry and Panzer Army 4. Classic set up for a pocket if I'm not careful.
Upon reflection I agree wrt Stalingrad. Perhaps I should try to preserve Rostov. That ought to be a challenge.
RKhan
Turn 24: Positioning
Turn 24 North.
The blizzard is about to hit but the Germans have not made much progress toward my northern ports during the snow turns. 7th Independent Army has done its work well with help from 8th Army in Northwest Front.
Surprisingly, a gap has opened behind the PA4 spearhead. This is really good for me as I want to pinch this off from next turn. Also, he has not taken over the entrenchments I left open when consolidating my lines. I'm now confident these can be taken over again in preparation for my attack. Finally, I move Shock Army 1 into position to support on this front. It has experienced rifle divisions which have just arrived from the east (Manchurian Army perhaps?).
The blizzard is about to hit but the Germans have not made much progress toward my northern ports during the snow turns. 7th Independent Army has done its work well with help from 8th Army in Northwest Front.
Surprisingly, a gap has opened behind the PA4 spearhead. This is really good for me as I want to pinch this off from next turn. Also, he has not taken over the entrenchments I left open when consolidating my lines. I'm now confident these can be taken over again in preparation for my attack. Finally, I move Shock Army 1 into position to support on this front. It has experienced rifle divisions which have just arrived from the east (Manchurian Army perhaps?).
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RKhan
Turn 24: Positioning
Turn 24 North post moves
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RKhan
Turn 24: Positioning
Turn 24 Center
In the center I find gaps I can exploit to set me up better for my winter offensive. 2 successful attacks and the way is open at Tula and Kursk. I also try to open a gap at Rzhev with no success. The picture below is post my moves. Note the cavalry army waiting to exploit from Tula.
In the center I find gaps I can exploit to set me up better for my winter offensive. 2 successful attacks and the way is open at Tula and Kursk. I also try to open a gap at Rzhev with no success. The picture below is post my moves. Note the cavalry army waiting to exploit from Tula.
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RKhan
Turn 24: Positioning
Turn 24 South
Again the way appears open for exactly where I want to attack and have positioned my best winter troops.
Again the way appears open for exactly where I want to attack and have positioned my best winter troops.
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RKhan
Turn 24: Positioning
Post my moves in the South. I pushed some Axis allied troops aside, and I have found opportunities near Kharkov as well.
Turn 25 has now arrived to the real fun is about to begin...
Turn 25 has now arrived to the real fun is about to begin...
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RKhan
RE: Turn 24: Positioning
ORIGINAL: RKhan
Turn 24 South
Again the way appears open for exactly where I want to attack and have positioned my best winter troops.
if your opponent wasn't doomed [8D], I'd suggest be careful here. In the winter you don't normally want terrain back (nice though that is), its all about creating a defensive perimeter for 1942 and generating a cadre of Gds formations. So a large push into a vacant region is nice but a bit of a distraction. Add on being too far from your rail heads in blizzard will cost you a lot of trucks.
RE: Turn 24: Positioning
ORIGINAL: loki100
ORIGINAL: RKhan
Turn 24 South
Again the way appears open for exactly where I want to attack and have positioned my best winter troops.
if your opponent wasn't doomed [8D], I'd suggest be careful here. In the winter you don't normally want terrain back (nice though that is), its all about creating a defensive perimeter for 1942 and generating a cadre of Gds formations. So a large push into a vacant region is nice but a bit of a distraction. Add on being too far from your rail heads in blizzard will cost you a lot of trucks.
Thank you Loki.
You are arguing for a logistics based war and I'm looking for a war of tempo, similar to Sillyflower when he dismembered BrianG. I want the German side bewildered and unable to react fast enough to the scale of assault.
Of course one would argue that the Soviet side is not built for this type of war, especially in 1941. Zhukov argued this out with Stalin in the first winter offensive. You can be Zhukov to my Stalin.
RKhan