PBEM files hacked

[geofflambert]

MILFs too.

[LoBaron]

ORIGINAL: Marshall
Can the PBEM file be password hacked?
I read a thread that it was done.
If so, the total concept of PBEM is dead.

Besides what the others have said, this game requires the opponents to establish a relationship based on trust, including the promise to be a reliable opponent over (not uncommmonly) several years of play, a general consensus on how to approach the houserule topic, and how to deal with defiencies in the game engine.

The potential hacking of minimalistic passwords surely is one of the lesser problems to consider when attempting to successfully engage in a PBEM.

[Marshall]

don't play Russians or Chinese, Voting for DT?

[Marshall]

Yes yes trust and all that crap, but if i read a thread that states save games have been hacked, I rather have confirmation that the files are secured in later updates.
And the answer I got back was, it is possible. now the advice I got so far, is to not play Chinese and Russians and to trust my fellow gamers.
And people who ask this Question ask it because they hacked the game file themselves. (amazing feat considering my skill set), also if I hacked the file, I would have had the answer to the question by myself

But the background of my check has been satisfied, I think that I know how and what happened.

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: Marshall

don't play Russians or Chinese, Voting for DT?

Il Duce? [:D]

That's politics, no more in this forum.

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Marshall

Yes yes trust and all that crap, but if i read a thread that states save games have been hacked, I rather have confirmation that the files are secured in later updates.
And the answer I got back was, it is possible. now the advice I got so far, is to not play Chinese and Russians and to trust my fellow gamers.
And people who ask this Question ask it because they hacked the game file themselves. (amazing feat considering my skill set), also if I hacked the file, I would have had the answer to the question by myself

But the background of my check has been satisfied, I think that I know how and what happened.

• It was pointed out to you that the thread about the game file hacked which you linked to was a different game.
• If someone works at it enough and has enough skills/knowledge, any file like that can be "hacked" by guessing the password eventually. That does not make the concept of PBM "dead" any more than burglars make the concept of houses dead.
• You missed the discussion about a player, not a regular on this forum, who (apparently) hacked the game using development tools and changed a bunch of settings on his side. "Roy" (IIRC) ran an AAR in a forum (I think in Germany but don't recall for sure) where as the Allies he very methodically started totally kicking his opponent's butt early on, counter-invading and such with forces that would have been crushed had he not cheated. People figured out "no way!" and eventually he admitted what he did. Even that did not make the concept of PBM "dead".
• There are a number of professional software developers on the forum who play PBM. Undoubtedly they have the skills and could, if they wished, do the same thing that "Roy" did, but they don't.
• "Trust and all that crap" is all that you have ever had, you just didn't understand that.

My advice is stop worrying and have fun! [8D]

[geofflambert]

Besides using gornish passwords, I always start my secret messages with something in an Earthling language. Let's see who here cracks it first.

9673 975362
[8D]

[LargeSlowTarget]

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

MILFs too.

"Men I like to fight" - like Kirk? [:'(]

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: LargeSlowTarget

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

MILFs too.

"Men I like to fight" - like Kirk? [:'(]

Yeah, that's it.

[geofflambert]

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

Besides using gornish passwords, I always start my secret messages with something in an Earthling language. Let's see who here cracks it first.

9673 975362
[8D]

Time!

First clue: It's just a straight substitution and so the message could only use 10 letters (if there was a message).
Pretend the numerals are letters.

[zuluhour]

This might work on scales

[Grfin Zeppelin]

Of course, done that in all my matches, its really easy to do. Aaah the joy of loading someone elses turn up...cant describe.

[LoBaron]

Thats something entirely different. You women usually get away with close to everything...

[Revthought]

Professional software developers? Here? That's disgusting, I'm out.

:Don't tell anyone you once made video games for a living:

What was I saying? Oh, I remember... I can't hang out with you guys anymore.

[wdolson]

ORIGINAL: Marshall

not interested in hacking, I am not a computer nerd, but I just want to know if the files are indeed safe.

We spend many years in a PBEM game, so if it can be hacked, that would really upset the PBEM game for me

As people have pointed out, Pac War is a very old game with very little in the way of security. War in the Pacific has much better security and War in the Pacific AE stepped that up even further. The team who did all the worked evolving WitP to AE had corporate IT experience and did quite a bit to make it difficult to hack any part of the saved game file.

The internal workings of the files for Pac War and AE have about as much in common as a 1962 VW Van and a new Tesla Model X. There are some common elements (steering wheel, tires, etc.), but they are very different beyond the basics.

Bill

[Revthought]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

• It was pointed out to you that the thread about the game file hacked which you linked to was a different game.
• If someone works at it enough and has enough skills/knowledge, any file like that can be "hacked" by guessing the password eventually. That does not make the concept of PBM "dead" any more than burglars make the concept of houses dead.
• You missed the discussion about a player, not a regular on this forum, who (apparently) hacked the game using development tools and changed a bunch of settings on his side. "Roy" (IIRC) ran an AAR in a forum (I think in Germany but don't recall for sure) where as the Allies he very methodically started totally kicking his opponent's butt early on, counter-invading and such with forces that would have been crushed had he not cheated. People figured out "no way!" and eventually he admitted what he did. Even that did not make the concept of PBM "dead".
• There are a number of professional software developers on the forum who play PBM. Undoubtedly they have the skills and could, if they wished, do the same thing that "Roy" did, but they don't.
• "Trust and all that crap" is all that you have ever had, you just didn't understand that.

My advice is stop worrying and have fun! [8D]

I want a link to this AAR. If it's in German, I can't read it, but I love internet drama. GoGo Google Translate!

[rustysi]

or even that another player can inadvertently cross-polinate the AARs if reading both sides,

I won't even read both sides if I intend to comment, just so I don't accidentally give anything away.

[Alfred]

There is no PBEM server for AE.  Which means that an AE PBEM saved game can only be hacked by those who directly receive the file.  In the ordinary course of a game that means either the Japanese or Allied player is hacking the game.
 
When someone raises this issue, what they are really saying is that they believe their opponent (either by themselves or by a friend of theirs):
 
1.  Has hacked the saved game file.
 
2.  Is hacking the saved game file.
 
3.  Intends to hack the saved game file.
 
There is no other possible interpretation as any electronic file is potentially liable to be hacked, just as sending a snail letter can be opened in transit or incorrectly delivered and mistakenly opened by the recipient.  Such a fear would preclude sending any emails ever as they too can be sent to the wrong people.
 
The only remedy for such paranoia is to not play PBEM at all.
 
Of course if one is simply being outplayed by a PBEM opponent there is a much simpler answer than the opponent is hacking the saved file.  Ockham's Razor applies and the opponent is simply a better player.
 
Alfred

[guytipton41]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

There is no PBEM server for AE.  Which means that an AE PBEM saved game can only be hacked by those who directly receive the file.  In the ordinary course of a game that means either the Japanese or Allied player is hacking the game.

When someone raises this issue, what they are really saying is that they believe their opponent (either by themselves or by a friend of theirs):

1.  Has hacked the saved game file.

2.  Is hacking the saved game file.

3.  Intends to hack the saved game file.

There is no other possible interpretation as any electronic file is potentially liable to be hacked, just as sending a snail letter can be opened in transit or incorrectly delivered and mistakenly opened by the recipient.  Such a fear would preclude sending any emails ever as they too can be sent to the wrong people.

The only remedy for such paranoia is to not play PBEM at all.

Of course if one is simply being outplayed by a PBEM opponent there is a much simpler answer than the opponent is hacking the saved file.  Ockham's Razor applies and the opponent is simply a better player.

Alfred

Hi Folks,

When I started the thread last year about crowd sourcing AE2 the one objection that really stopped me cold was: "If the source is out there nobody would play because the other person could be modifying the it." So I was leaning toward a PBEM server where the turns would be submitted for execution. However this thread makes me suppose that is overthinking the problem. Perhaps trust would be a better solution.

In my real job we're looking at running a Power PC program on a X86 using a VM with QEMU. Performance is inadequate so we are intercepting opcodes in runtime and identifying which ones can executed in native mode. QEMU already does this (translation blocks) but we're being much more aggressive. The take away is - anything that can be run in a VM can be trivially modified - even when going out to a PAM. And very few programs can not be run in a VM.

Cheers,
Guy

[JockJimmy]

9673 975362

HEIL HITLER.

Is this a ref. to one of the tricks that ULTRA used when breaking enigma? (That the Germasns often signed off using this tag.)