The Zhukov-less Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Moderators: Joel Billings, Sabre21
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
22 February- 7 March 1945 (193rd & 194th weeks of the war)
We have reached the outskirts of Berlin. The Western Allies meanwhile are still 200 miles to the west. Comrade Stalin emphasizes once again the need to take Berlin before the Spring thaw in order to eliminate any possibility of Germany making a separate peace while our armies are stalled in the mud.
Our attacks across the front are carefully timed from south to north, and then north to south in order to draw off German mobile reserves from intervening in the crucial center battles closest to the German capital.
Battles along the front
Reaching the gates of Berlin
We have reached the outskirts of Berlin. The Western Allies meanwhile are still 200 miles to the west. Comrade Stalin emphasizes once again the need to take Berlin before the Spring thaw in order to eliminate any possibility of Germany making a separate peace while our armies are stalled in the mud.
Our attacks across the front are carefully timed from south to north, and then north to south in order to draw off German mobile reserves from intervening in the crucial center battles closest to the German capital.
Battles along the front
Reaching the gates of Berlin
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Looking back Dave did better then historical, but will lose sooner then historical.
Russia simply has to hang on to Moscow at all costs.
Why playing sudden death or Bitter End is the only way to go.
.08 will help Russia some at beginning and Germany 43-45
Hopefully games like this where both players are good to great will end in a historical draw.
Both of you seemed to not make any major mistakes.
Russia simply has to hang on to Moscow at all costs.
Why playing sudden death or Bitter End is the only way to go.
.08 will help Russia some at beginning and Germany 43-45
Hopefully games like this where both players are good to great will end in a historical draw.
Both of you seemed to not make any major mistakes.
Beta Tester WitW & WitE
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Actually game is going pretty close to historical all in all March 1945 on is pretty much a draw in my book. As berlin was encircle late April early may if I remember right and with that encirclement the Soviets were far to the west of Berlin....so looking pretty dead on for historical ending...esp if you read up that only being overly cautious in a couple phases is why the Soviets didnt get there earlier historically....mopping up the northern German pockets due to a thought that a massive german flanking attack could happen on a drive on Berlin early---despite that really the Germans had no real capability left.....also after bagration it was about a miracle the Germans reformed a line at all in Poland to slow the Soviets. Believe even the Germans didnt believe they could stem the soviet advance and only some amazing leadership by certain german commanders helped to stabilize the situation. That and the commitment of almost all the German armored forces and complete sacrifice of Romania and AG South lol.
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
8-14 March 1945 (195th week of the war)
Attacks continue the length of the front. Three German divisions are forced to surrender at Swinemuende. In Berlin, the first task of the assault forces is to reduce the heavy fortifications within the city. Three separate assaults are launched in order to reduce the defensive strength of the fascist troops.
Attacks to the north and in the area around Berlin.
Southern attacks
Swinemuende
Berlin
Attacks continue the length of the front. Three German divisions are forced to surrender at Swinemuende. In Berlin, the first task of the assault forces is to reduce the heavy fortifications within the city. Three separate assaults are launched in order to reduce the defensive strength of the fascist troops.
Attacks to the north and in the area around Berlin.
Southern attacks
Swinemuende
Berlin
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Wow The Horde from Mordor is at the gates of Gondor.
Where is Gandalf?
Hes got to hold on for a few more turns.
Where is Gandalf?
Hes got to hold on for a few more turns.
Beta Tester WitW & WitE
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
15-21 March 1945 (196th week of the war)
Many German infantry divisions along the front have now lost heart against the relentless Red Army assaults and flee westwards. Only the mechanized and SS forces withdraw in good order. In some places our attacks are even checked, but the signs of impending collapse of the Wehrmacht are clear.
Two assaults are again launched at the city center. Still the fascists manage to hold on, but the noose is growing tighter. There is no evidence of any German counterattack to delay the inevitable.
North
Center
South
Battles
Berlin 1
Berlin 2
Supporting artillery for Berlin assaults
Many German infantry divisions along the front have now lost heart against the relentless Red Army assaults and flee westwards. Only the mechanized and SS forces withdraw in good order. In some places our attacks are even checked, but the signs of impending collapse of the Wehrmacht are clear.
Two assaults are again launched at the city center. Still the fascists manage to hold on, but the noose is growing tighter. There is no evidence of any German counterattack to delay the inevitable.
North
Center
South
Battles
Berlin 1
Berlin 2
Supporting artillery for Berlin assaults
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
22-28 March 1945 (197th week of the war)
Red Army troops have driven the die-hard fascists from West Berlin and now control this portion of the city. The last escape route to the west is almost closed now.
Another attack is launched at the city center. Fighting goes on street by street, building by building, with Red Army troops and artillery slowly gaining ground towards the Reichstag and fuhrerbunker. The end is almost at hand.
Red Army troops have driven the die-hard fascists from West Berlin and now control this portion of the city. The last escape route to the west is almost closed now.
Another attack is launched at the city center. Fighting goes on street by street, building by building, with Red Army troops and artillery slowly gaining ground towards the Reichstag and fuhrerbunker. The end is almost at hand.
- smokindave34
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RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Where is Steiner!
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RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
29 March- 4 April 1945 (198th and final week of the war)
The northern portion of Berlin falls to Red Army troops. A final assault is ordered by Comrade Stalin to end this conflict.
Three quarters of a million men and twenty thousand guns deliver the final blow on the remaining defenders at the heart of the Reich.
Gotterdammerung
Our flag flies above the Reichstag
And the result is...
Victory Points
The northern portion of Berlin falls to Red Army troops. A final assault is ordered by Comrade Stalin to end this conflict.
Three quarters of a million men and twenty thousand guns deliver the final blow on the remaining defenders at the heart of the Reich.
Gotterdammerung
Our flag flies above the Reichstag
And the result is...
Victory Points
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
well done to both of you ... really enjoyable AAR.
you've come a long way from having your back to the Volga to early 1943.
I fully approve of using more than 20,000 guns in one attack [;)]
you've come a long way from having your back to the Volga to early 1943.
I fully approve of using more than 20,000 guns in one attack [;)]
- smokindave34
- Posts: 881
- Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:56 am
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Great game M60, I'm glad we finally got one over the finish line! I was hoping to hold out one more turn to make it to mud (and most likely the historical end date) but even my elite fanatical troops could not hold off that massive offensive on Berlin.
Your Bagration style offensive in early summer really put me on my heels for the entire summer '44 campaign. I had hoped the Dnepr would slow you down but alas I waited one turn too long. You also did a great job of farming morale/experience for your Tank/Mech corps from '42 on. They turned into real beasts in 1944.
Well done Comrade!
Your Bagration style offensive in early summer really put me on my heels for the entire summer '44 campaign. I had hoped the Dnepr would slow you down but alas I waited one turn too long. You also did a great job of farming morale/experience for your Tank/Mech corps from '42 on. They turned into real beasts in 1944.
Well done Comrade!
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RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
This AAR does make me wonder: how big of an army can Soviet industry support if we assume trucks are not an issue? Because I notice most people here don't push their Red Army very far beyond 9-10 mil if they can help it but here you had a Soviet armed forces with 12 mil+ at one point.
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Dave played a great game and every bit as important he finished it. There just aren't enough people who will stick it out to the end.
I really was unsure that Moscow was going to hold out in 1941 as my best units took positions in the last fort line by the capital at the start of winter. The Summer 42 offensive had the Red Army constantly falling back until things started to turn around at Stalingrad. A couple times near Rostov and south of lake Ilmen I got very careless, but the resulting damage was contained by the endless manpower reserves. The drive to get over the Dnepr south of Kiev was crucial to my success during Winter 43-44. The pocket created by Operation Bagration involved a lot of pre-work and I thought it important not attracting attention in that area in the weeks leading up to the attack. Once that was successful, it did seem as if the drive to the west was on, and it ended as well as I could have hoped.
The whole Hungarian operation I think people were a little hard on the Axis play. I didn't realize myself that there was a break in the mountain chain at this place called the Dukla Pass, allowing me to get around the Hungarians and I'm sure others were similarly unaware. Well now people know.
Overall I was satisfied playing the game, although the air changes in the later patches messed things up for me. One small note, maybe for Wite2, Soviet promotions to General Armii are currently too easy, promotion to Marshal of the S.U. too tough. I'd say forget resetting counters, if you have 350 victories and are a political rating 7, you make Marshal. Political rating of 6 takes 400 victories. Just my $.02.
I really was unsure that Moscow was going to hold out in 1941 as my best units took positions in the last fort line by the capital at the start of winter. The Summer 42 offensive had the Red Army constantly falling back until things started to turn around at Stalingrad. A couple times near Rostov and south of lake Ilmen I got very careless, but the resulting damage was contained by the endless manpower reserves. The drive to get over the Dnepr south of Kiev was crucial to my success during Winter 43-44. The pocket created by Operation Bagration involved a lot of pre-work and I thought it important not attracting attention in that area in the weeks leading up to the attack. Once that was successful, it did seem as if the drive to the west was on, and it ended as well as I could have hoped.
The whole Hungarian operation I think people were a little hard on the Axis play. I didn't realize myself that there was a break in the mountain chain at this place called the Dukla Pass, allowing me to get around the Hungarians and I'm sure others were similarly unaware. Well now people know.
Overall I was satisfied playing the game, although the air changes in the later patches messed things up for me. One small note, maybe for Wite2, Soviet promotions to General Armii are currently too easy, promotion to Marshal of the S.U. too tough. I'd say forget resetting counters, if you have 350 victories and are a political rating 7, you make Marshal. Political rating of 6 takes 400 victories. Just my $.02.
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
ORIGINAL: obssesednuker
This AAR does make me wonder: how big of an army can Soviet industry support if we assume trucks are not an issue? Because I notice most people here don't push their Red Army very far beyond 9-10 mil if they can help it but here you had a Soviet armed forces with 12 mil+ at one point.
It's not just a larger army, but without truck limitations the Soviet player would have far more aircraft and AFVs in play in the form of mechanized and tank corps that are a large consumer of trucks.
The real problem for the Soviet player when it comes to trucks is the blizzard conditions. Even when the distance to the railhead was short, I still had to pull much of the air force in to keep from running my truck fleet into an even deeper hole.
RE: The Zhukov Memoirs - GC41-45 M60 vs smokindave redux
Your Bagration Offensive was what won the game clearly.
June 44 Dave had the space in the north to give and the manpower to make it to July 1st 45 as it was he almost made it to May.
He should have planed on pulling back 2-4 hexes that first clear turn north of The Marsh as he had allot of space to give.
It is very tempting to think a major river can hold back the best Russian units summer of 44.
Once summer 44 hits the only area Germany can hold the line is just to east of Warsaw, also because of your Bagration Offensive dave did not have the troops to properly defend Hungary - not that it ever really matters
Hungary is a real truck sinkhole for sure winter 44/45.
Your far better now then when we played a few yrs ago.
One of the few truly great 44 operations by a Russian player for the win.
June 44 Dave had the space in the north to give and the manpower to make it to July 1st 45 as it was he almost made it to May.
He should have planed on pulling back 2-4 hexes that first clear turn north of The Marsh as he had allot of space to give.
It is very tempting to think a major river can hold back the best Russian units summer of 44.
Once summer 44 hits the only area Germany can hold the line is just to east of Warsaw, also because of your Bagration Offensive dave did not have the troops to properly defend Hungary - not that it ever really matters
Hungary is a real truck sinkhole for sure winter 44/45.
Your far better now then when we played a few yrs ago.
One of the few truly great 44 operations by a Russian player for the win.
Beta Tester WitW & WitE