2by3 to publish Steel Tigers

[Max 86]

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore
So, with all that you could very well get your top down look but I'm trying to visualize how they can IMPROVE on those "awful" graphics and blotches of infantry.

I would , no doubt about it, buy a remake of SP with the exact same look and feel but updated to work flawlessly with Win7/8/10/etc..but I wouldn't mind an improved top down view. I think most agree that the old look is the MINIMUM that would be acceptable, the baseline to measure against, but with today's capabilities I would think they could do some pretty nice top down graphics.

Either way...hurray! they're remaking SP! [&o] [&o] [&o]

[Jeffrey H.]

ORIGINAL: PipFromSlitherine

I think bodies will probably be left in the same way we do in BA, though no blood. We are aiming for a high quality visual look and feel - though nothing indicative to show yet, or indeed for a while!

Cheers

Pip

I don't have any experience with the BA game mentioned here and in other places so I took a look at the screenshots on the Slitherine website.

I don't like the graphics of that game, it's a little bit too much toy timey silliness for my tastes.

Lets hope for something different.

[wodin]

Well I don't agree aswell. Top down is fine by me. If a game is designed top down it means you don't have to mess around with camera angles etc.

I think a majority of wargamers who will buy ST will want top down graphics. That doesn't mean they have to look bad though. Make sure there are some great visual effects and great animations then I'm more than happy with top down. Plus when a game is designed as top down it makes playing the wargame much easier. What I would like to see is the same scale for all units and terrain features. Also for the units to have a gritty realistic look and not a Battle Academy cartoon look.

Saying if the game doesn't go more 3D visually then it's no improvement is a strange thing to say when it's actually gameplay features where the important improvements will be.

It really wouldn't be a Steel Panthers type game if it wasn't top down. Honestly the last thing I'd want to see is it looking like Battle Academy. You could make top down graphics look way better than that game anyway. Actually when I play BA I always use the top down view anyway. Just much easier to play the game that way I find.

ORIGINAL: Matt R

Maybe for YOU but not for everybody else. Too me the top down look of a tank or truck or any of the vehicles was dry and boring. I almost didn't play because of that. No, I surely hope that is the "one" technique they "don't" use in Steel Tigers. If it is then there's been really no improvement on the looks of the game.

I have a strong feeling you're in the minority on this one, my friend [:D]

I've been modding SP icons for years. In fact, the crappy-looking infantry icons in last official release of WaW and Enhanced.. I'm guilty of those travesties [;)]

[JEB Davis]

ORIGINAL: Max 86

ORIGINAL: Riitaoja

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore
Just a thought but there is another counter system I could get into for this game and that's Mark Walker's counters and units in Heroes of Stalingrad. Let me hear what ya think about that? [:)]

ORIGINAL: map66
I agree completely there--- those HOS counters are great, and in many ways would work better than 2d or 3d "realistic" models to convey information.

ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.
That counter and map style is just about what I want to see. Although the game module concept of that release was/is simply too skinny in content for me. A good and bad example in that sense.

Wait, what?

One of the reasons I got hooked into Steel Panthers was that it was not your standard cardboard counters strategy game but instead had "real" tanks moving around in the terrain. Those unit counter graphics are dry and take away the immersion.

Major +1. At a minimum, it has to have top down view with rotating turrets and little flaming wrecks, same as before. Craters in the terrain too, relative to artillery size.

Major +2

Counters would not be good. Mouseover gives information. Click for more, esc cancels. Very easy.

[JEB Davis]

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore

ORIGINAL: **budd**

I hope they stay with the top down look. I have every confidence in 2x3.

I hope they don't. [:'(] I have every confidence in 2x3. (I'm really hoping for the Battle Academy look)

I'm hoping the HIGH quality VISUAL look gave it away. [:)]

Just out of curiousity, what is wrong with Rising Sun?

Jason Petho

What isn't? Here's the short list:

1. Yellow Tanks? (they could have used the bases and put the real color of tanks and other units for the Japs.

2. Everything way too small. It was almost like playing a Close Combat game which I don't for that exact reason.

3. Movement too slow (two hexes a turn for the inf? it takes forever to get into the action)

4. Cricket sound was annoying and terrible.

5. Takes too long for the engagements to start in random battles. Especially with that 2 hex movement of inf. front lines should have been 2 to 3 turns apart no more than 5.

6. Had to click every side exchange in an AI vs AI match just trying to watch how a game plays in the beginning. It's still annoying in a regular game when it's the AI's turn. If I click end turn it should be end turn and I don't have to click for the AI to start moving.

7. Too many units to move in a regiment vs regiment battle the smallest battle in the game and it took forever to finish just my turn let alone watching the ai move in a non-fog game.

8. AI generally braindead like most Tiller games.

Mostly it just looked and played like a toy soldiers in a sandbox. Too small icons and too long for a turn to pass.

What else would you like to know? [:)]

I almost hate to say this... but I really don't.

aaa it looks like you don't want a Steel Panthers game at all!
You keep describing something else altogether.

[Erik Rutins]

Hi guys,

The visuals will be very high quality. It will not look like Battle Academy, which had its own art style, it will look like a much better Steel Panthers.

We really can't say much more at this point, despite all the interest, but I'm glad to see that you are all interested!

Regards,

- Erik

[Ratzki]

Why not stick with top-down but reduce the hex size to allow for a little more interesting maps?

[JEB Davis]

ORIGINAL: Ratzki

Why not stick with top-down but reduce the hex size to allow for a little more interesting maps?

I've liked that idea for years. How about 25m hexes.

[76mm]

ORIGINAL: Werewolf1326
NO MORE EAST FRONT!...But please GOD! No more Eastern front. Give it a freakin' rest!

yeah, please give us more D-Day or Battle of the Bulge!
[>:][>:][>:]

There are lots of battles/situations on the East Front which have rarely, if ever, been modeled...

Sure, variety is a good thing, but trying to sell a game like this without the East Front (or D-Day/Bulge) would be a little nutty...

[wodin]

Is 25m abit small when dealing with squad size units, esp for the nations who had large squads?

@Pip, has work actually started on ST? Or is it all about the new engine at the moment? If so how far along is the new engine?

[hellfish6]

I like 2-D top down. I still think the icons from the SP series are pretty snazzy looking.

[marcpennington]

I'm OK with either top down or a semi-3d isometric view. I just hope they choose one or the other and not try and do both, as when games do that, there tend to be compromises, and I'd much rather them pouring all resources into one or the other to make it look as good as possible.

For that matter I'm OK with counters or "models" (or whatever one calls the units in the original SP). If counters though, I really hope they follow of the LnL model of detailed pictures of units, as that was always part of the appeal of SP.

[aaatoysandmore]

Well, if it's top down you can count me out because I have 6 renditions of that old tried method. Without a REAL graphics improvement to the icons there's no need to buy into another. But, I guess for the new kids on the block and old fuddy duddies it will be ok. I'm old but I try to move with the now and the future. [:-]

I have my Norbsoft games and I'll be playing those. Has the kind of graphics I like and the ability to chose how much of the game I want to take part in. Best game ever made to me. That includes your Steel Panthers. If only CA and Total War franchise could get him to code their battle engine and AI. (sigh)

I'm done here though I think I got enough information out of Pip and Erik for what I needed to know. Don't ya just love how I do that guys? If I hadn't caused a conflict it might have been awhile before you knew. [:D]

[JEB Davis]

Here's a good reference for a 50m hex.
It was taken from AH Tobruk (the original) which used 75m hexes (IIRC).
Years ago I edited it by drawing a 50m hex over it and removing the 75m.

[/img]

[Riitaoja]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Hi guys,

The visuals will be very high quality. It will not look like Battle Academy, which had its own art style, it will look like a much better Steel Panthers.

We really can't say much more at this point, despite all the interest, but I'm glad to see that you are all interested!

Regards,

- Erik

Thats great to hear!

[Alchenar]

The graphics themselves aren't so much of an issue for me - you can do tremendous things with 2d sprites on a flat hex map so long as you base everything around a consistent style.

What I'm interested in is if we're going to get a UI that's based around modern design principles or whether we're going to get the usual 2by3 'good for Windows 3.1' effort.

[modrow]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Hi guys,

The visuals will be very high quality. It will not look like Battle Academy, which had its own art style, it will look like a much better Steel Panthers.

We really can't say much more at this point, despite all the interest, but I'm glad to see that you are all interested!

Regards,

- Erik

Erik,

no need to say much... just make sure you can sell us the game as soon as possible in standard 2x3 quality... [8D]
How about a new thread in the "coming soon" section?

Hartwig

[Ratzki]

ORIGINAL: JEB Davis

Here's a good reference for a 50m hex.
It was taken from AH Tobruk (the original) which used 75m hexes (IIRC).
Years ago I edited it by drawing a 50m hex over it and removing the 75m.

[/img]

I think that 25m+/- would work well, at least for WW2.

[marcpennington]

So it's been like a month. Any chance for a developer hint or some such on how this is going? I know a screenshot as such is probably too much, but I can't imagine this one being anything other than the most anticipated computer war-game of all time, so any scraps would work. Just give us the model graphic of one tank or something, than I will shut up for another month.

[operating]

+1