Isolated Axis units in Ports

Gary Grigsby’s War in the West 1943-45 is the most ambitious and detailed computer wargame on the Western Front of World War II ever made. Starting with the Summer 1943 invasions of Sicily and Italy and proceeding through the invasions of France and the drive into Germany, War in the West brings you all the Allied campaigns in Western Europe and the capability to re-fight the Western Front according to your plan.

Moderators: Joel Billings, RedLancer

JamesM
Posts: 1024
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2000 8:00 am
Location: QLD, Australia

Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by JamesM »

How does the logistics side work with regards to isolated axis units in ports? Is there a maximum distance that the isolated unit has to be from a supplied port to receive supplies? The reason I am asking, I am playing the 43-45 campaign and in am in December 43 and there are isolated pockets in Messina, Toranto, Crotone and Brindisi. I have setup naval patrols in a 2 hex radius around these ports and i have been constantly attacking with significant troop and equipment differential, especially Messina for a couple of months and seem to be barley scratching these units. I thought that they would have run out of supplies fairly quick from the constant attacking.
User avatar
JeffroK
Posts: 6395
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 4:05 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by JeffroK »

Too easy for the Werhmacht to hole up in any port.

Someone seems to have read about them holing up in some well prepared ancient fortress behind swamps and canals and decided that any port could be a "Tobruk"

Seem to have not read the bits about how unprepared Italian ports were or how quickly Cherbourg, Le Havre & Calais actually fell.
Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum
marion61
Posts: 1706
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:57 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by marion61 »

Are you also hitting the rail yards inside the hex? This also has supplies in them that units can use. Sometimes it just takes awhile to reduce them. Your isolating them by sea, so they can only receive supply by air. Make sure your using one hq to ground attack, with plenty of artillery. It takes the stored supply time to run down, you just have to be persistent.
User avatar
Fallschirmjager
Posts: 3555
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2002 12:46 am
Location: Chattanooga, Tennessee

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Fallschirmjager »

If you hover the mouse over a hex you can see the amount of freight inside of it.
In my last game I used a good portion of the 15th air force to bomb a single hex and destroy the port and rail yard and then over successive attacks you can see the freight drop.

You just have to keep attacking with lots of artillery and engineers to reduce the forts. Rotate in fresh units to keep fatigue low.
User avatar
Seminole
Posts: 2237
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:56 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Seminole »

Are you using your TFs to bust these coastal positions?
Those heavy naval guns are hard to resist.

TFs can be moved adjacent to any enemy on the coast for an attack and then moved back to cover their temp port, or permanent port for prep, before the turn ends.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
cfulbright
Posts: 2782
Joined: Tue May 06, 2003 11:12 pm

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by cfulbright »

The TF also cuts off sea-based supply, and according to the game designers, is the only way to isolate ports from sea supply.

Cary
User avatar
Fallschirmjager
Posts: 3555
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2002 12:46 am
Location: Chattanooga, Tennessee

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Fallschirmjager »

ORIGINAL: Seminole

Are you using your TFs to bust these coastal positions?
Those heavy naval guns are hard to resist.

TFs can be moved adjacent to any enemy on the coast for an attack and then moved back to cover their temp port, or permanent port for prep, before the turn ends.


This is good to know!
JamesM
Posts: 1024
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2000 8:00 am
Location: QLD, Australia

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by JamesM »

I will try the TF ideas, thank for that one. The question is were the Italian port cities that tough to take and how far is too far for the Axis forces to send sea supplies i.e Messina had been isolated for at least a month and the closest supply port is Naples? Also were there any battleships assigned to the Italian invasions?
User avatar
LiquidSky
Posts: 2811
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:28 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by LiquidSky »



Pretty much every port in Europe had Germans holed up in them fortified. Ask the Canadian Army who had to clear them.
“My logisticians are a humorless lot … they know if my campaign fails, they are the first ones I will slay.” – Alexander the Great
User avatar
Seminole
Posts: 2237
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:56 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Seminole »

ORIGINAL: jamesm
I will try the TF ideas, thank for that one. The question is were the Italian port cities that tough to take and how far is too far for the Axis forces to send sea supplies i.e Messina had been isolated for at least a month and the closest supply port is Naples? Also were there any battleships assigned to the Italian invasions?

I have not found the port forts too tough when I bring naval guns.
Even hasty attacks with naval gunfire support can annihilate fort levels.

With respect to port isolation, Messina can be isolated from resupply over the sea, but aren't units there going to draw supply over the ferry from Reggio Calabria when the depot is finally drained?
If Reggio Calabria is also blocked from naval supply it will get some over the rail network depending how taxed that is.

TF can block flow of supplies in adjacent hexes. I positioned one in the Straits of Messina, up his units could still move around it and it took a beating. If you wanted to block the flow of supplies and you're willing to devote two TF you should be able to position on either side of the ferry lanes (but NOT next to an enemy port) and force him to air supply or get out. I think they would suffer isolation effects once you did this too. This assumes the other island ports are cut off from Messina or another supply source (due to naval interdiction or port damage >95% - I think, someone correct if that percentage is off).
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
User avatar
JeffroK
Posts: 6395
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 4:05 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by JeffroK »

ORIGINAL: LiquidSky



Pretty much every port in Europe had Germans holed up in them fortified. Ask the Canadian Army who had to clear them.
Big difference between the ancient French Fortified ports of Le Havre, Calais, Dunkerque, Lorient, Brest etc and the southern Italian ports like Crotone, Brindisi, Salerno et al.

While something should aid the defence of the French ports, not every port in game was a fortress.
Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum
Smirfy
Posts: 1057
Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2004 8:24 pm

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Smirfy »

Thats the truth they were prepared with supplies and Hitler had picked the garrison commanders
User avatar
Balou
Posts: 848
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:12 pm

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Balou »

ORIGINAL: jamesm

How does the logistics side work with regards to isolated axis units in ports?

Need help. From play testing I got this one, but I cannot figure out why axis units are isolated.

Invasion Denmark, axis rail lines to Germany shutdown, but sea lanes to the east under axis control. Why is Aarhus isolated ? The insert (no freight in Aarhus) tells me something didn't work well with resupplying Aarhus.

Image
Attachments
Denmarkisolated.jpg
Denmarkisolated.jpg (466.35 KiB) Viewed 147 times
“Aim towards enemy“.
- instructions on U.S. rocket launcher
marion61
Posts: 1706
Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:57 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by marion61 »

Maybe the Danish resistance is at work?[;)]
JamesM
Posts: 1024
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2000 8:00 am
Location: QLD, Australia

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by JamesM »

ORIGINAL: Seminole

Are you using your TFs to bust these coastal positions?
Those heavy naval guns are hard to resist.

TFs can be moved adjacent to any enemy on the coast for an attack and then moved back to cover their temp port, or permanent port for prep, before the turn ends.

How do you get the TF to attack these coastal positions apart from launching an invasion? I have tried a deliberate and hasty attacks but no go.
User avatar
Joel Billings
Posts: 33034
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 8:00 am
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Contact:

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Joel Billings »

Do you have a save you can attach or email to 2by3@2by3games.com with the situation in Denmark?
All understanding comes after the fact.
-- Soren Kierkegaard
User avatar
Balou
Posts: 848
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:12 pm

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Balou »

Can do. PM sent.
“Aim towards enemy“.
- instructions on U.S. rocket launcher
User avatar
Seminole
Posts: 2237
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 12:56 am

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Seminole »

How do you get the TF to attack these coastal positions apart from launching an invasion? I have tried a deliberate and hasty attacks but no go.


The TFs don't need to be selected for the attack, just position them adjacent to the hex your ground forces are attacking and you'll see the TFs listed in your battle report as participating.

See if you can spot the stack that is about to have a bad day:

Image
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
User avatar
Joel Billings
Posts: 33034
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 8:00 am
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Contact:

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Joel Billings »

The Danish situation is caused by the fact that Berlin is surrounded and all rail to the south are cut. This means that the ports on the Baltic Sea, although in supply themselves by land, are unable to pass on the supply chain over the Baltic. The question I have, is why didn't the player attack Berlin the turn before and end the game?
All understanding comes after the fact.
-- Soren Kierkegaard
User avatar
Joel Billings
Posts: 33034
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 8:00 am
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Contact:

RE: Isolated Axis units in Ports

Post by Joel Billings »

ORIGINAL: cfulbright

The TF also cuts off sea-based supply, and according to the game designers, is the only way to isolate ports from sea supply.

Cary

Not exactly true. You can also isolate the ports by gaining control of the hexes through naval air interdiction.
All understanding comes after the fact.
-- Soren Kierkegaard
Post Reply

Return to “Gary Grigsby's War in the West”