CAULDRON - US-Allies versus EURCON - 1998

[George Patton]

It would be cool to play the scenario with EURCON.

[tommo8993]

Just finished reading this book. Yeah it would be cool playing EUROCON

[Coiler12]

I've also read the book and it's not very good.

Taken in isolation, the fighting isn't too bad. However, the novel as a whole has two major flaws. The first is that it was written in the awkward immediate post-USSR "Who do we use as the antagonist now?". The second is that rather than just quickly glossing over the absurdities of the premise, the book drags the politics on for waaaay too long before the real draw begins.

[djoos5]

This scenario is still in work. I am currently learning to play with the new scripting tool that we now have.

Give me time to polish this up. I do not like how it plays, right now - might even size it down some or turn it into a series of battles. But, I have no problem re-tooling it to make EURCON as a playable side.

I will keep you all posted.

[magi]

Hurry… I really want to play this scenario… The idea is very intriguing… When you have the next version I would love the beta play… good luck…
you don't have to completely follow the storyline… It should just be a template or a guideline.. A theme..... The addition of Eurocon naval assets and forces would be more realistic and interesting addition… I hope you would include that…

[magi]

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

Just starting up. A couple observations on US force allocation:

-The USAF’s 48th FW has been at RAF Lakenheath for several decades and would make a good basis for the USAF presence.

http://www.lakenheath.af.mil/library/fa ... p?id=10661
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/48th_Fighter_Wing

That’s 48 x F-15E’s and 24 x F-15C’s – nice package

Some other USAF forces ready in Europe, are here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... ces_Africa - some would have to move due to the scenario but the 48th would certainly be in place I think.

-I think some RN elements would be useful, perhaps a Type 23 or two as part of the convoy escorts – which could certainly use an ASW FF or 2. Perhaps an RN sub.

-The CVBG’s are a bit thin on ‘Cold War’ style escorts. One more CG and one more ASW escort would not be out of place but probably not critical – also the escorts don’t have their ASW Helo’s, which are essential.

-RAF Fighter Sqns are usually 12 A/C each

-I believe that the only base remaining in the UK that can host the B-52 is RAF Fairford, could be wrong on that but it is certainly the base most associated with them.
-RAF Mildenhall is the natural start point for the tankers and heavies (E-3s) but they could be almost anywhere

-You mention in the brief that there are 22 C-130’s for the 82nd and 101st. There are only 10 at the base but in reality 22 might be able to drop a Brigade on light scales, and only the 82nd as the 101st is an Air Assault Div with its own Aviation Bde and is not airborne as such.
-Along that line you may want to mention the Brit, 16th Air Assault Bde which has elements that can do both airborne and airmobile.

These are all minor points – it looks like a good set up and I remember reading the book many years ago – a good one.

Gunner… You are such a. Marvel..... A great resource… Your scenarios are by far my favorite the attention to detail and the Plausible doctrine etc. etc. it's outstanding really…

[djoos5]

Ok- this scenario is in re-editing.

The book had very little naval action except to see France and Germany try to bomb a US taskforce out of existence. It doesn't mean the scenario needs follow suit. Do you think I should add British, French, and German naval forces?

It is a continental conflict, so I do not want to have too high of an AU count - that can kill a game.

I will wait to hear some opinions as I work on the redesign.


Things that have been added so far:
images
overlays
new LUA scripting for cool effects
mission edits
Gunner98 comments and suggestions have been taken into account

[magi]

^^^i like big.... hurry i want to play it....

[djoos5]

Give me a week to get things cleaned up, Magi, and I should have it ready to beta test. [:D]

Knowing that they have the upper hand by controlling the necessary sea lanes by using land-based aircraft, would Germany and France put to sea any great force of surface ships to confront American and British carrier battle groups? Submarines I can definitely see being a platform to control the waterways around the European continent, but would they use ships? If they did use ships, would they position them far out to sea in either the Atlantic or North Sea?

If so, what would you suggest the makeup to be of any combined fleet SAG or CBG?

[magi]

Okiedokie.... I need to look at this… I'm going to go loaded up now…

[magi]

Okay… just looking at the opening scenario and looking at the map… And reading the briefs… We may as well say that we are at war with EurCon....
In the greater strategic picture… They are screwed…
The first thing would be to block them from breaking out Into the Atlantic… Deny them access to the Straits of Gibraltar and to the Suez Canal… and inhibit their commercial sea traffic into the Atlantic from their coats… that in itself would bring about their eventual demise…
The alpha objective for blue force is to relieve the Slavic Alies... VIa sea lanes through the Baltic......
EuroCon alpha objective is to deny this relief operation…
That means realistically it will be a huge battle in the North Sea… Where EurCon should place major naval assets blocking and denying access to the Baltic…
Then they could have assets in three dimensions through the Baltic all the way to .... Fighting a massive battle of attrition…
This is a can-do for the allies...... It would be a huge costly battle… But eventually they would prevail and EuroCon would have to submit…

[magi]

There is too much separation between… CVY – 7.1… CVY – 7.2… The carrier battle group CVBG – 22.1... They should be deployed in closer proximity to provide mutual support… With the carrier battle group leading the way…
CVY – 7.2 have no organic ASW air assets which seems improbable…
I don't understand the positioning of CVB G – 22.2 so far to the south…
There should be OECM Aircraft… EC – 130H compass call… EF – 111A ravens or somesuch thing… In both Poland and Great Britain…
There should be easy – E-8C joint STAR in both Great Britain in Poland…
There should be antiradiation missiles and capable carriers… In both Poland and Great Britain...
The British should have subsurface forces in the North Sea

These are the things I see at first glance… It might be more once I started it…
I love how big this thing is… And should be bigger maybe....

[djoos5]

Thanks, Magi! I appreciate the second set of eyes.

Let me give you my thoughts on the design - including the theme of the novel on which this scenario will now be loosely based. These thoughts may require a re-wording for the opening brief and ROE.

Postures: France and Germany are now allied and have basically pressured the smaller nations into this thing called the European Confederation (EurCon). Poland doesn't wish to join, and so EurCon is trying to force them in by sabotage and cutting off fuel lines, communications, and resources by closing the sea lanes to Gdansk. Their goal is to have the Poles submit to this new governing alliance.

America and England are sending aid - both resources and military (with caveats such as training mission) - but have not committed to aggression against the EurCon. Nobody on the allied side wants war. EurCon on the other hand being bully-ish and feeling indomitable due to the old problem for American aid having to cross 1,000's of miles of ocean, are willing to smash any aid that might come believing America and England don't have the political will to hash out another European affair. In the book they go as far as nukes to destroy an interfering carrier group.

Positions: So, that is why the current set up. US is just moving assets into place and their priority mission is relief to Poland, not making war. Thus CVBG 22.2 is so far south.

As for moving the CVBG's into the North Sea - should they? With the range of US aircraft to give overhead support to the convoys, would they bring the carriers into such a small area of water? I know... the North Sea is not small per se, but it would probably have carrier captains in a bit of a frenzy to be within land-base strike distance, too.

I am not broadening the battle to the Med - so no Straits or North American blockings. Even though this is a continental conflict, I want to try and keep it close to the book and have the action happen in the North Sea and Baltic. This too should limit AU counts and make the scenario run more quickly. I do not like playing scenarios that are bogged down due to the overwhelmed PC processor having so many assets to manage.

Otherwise, I am going to take your recommendations and put them into play. I will add the new assets to the US and EurCon forces. I will add more subs and surface vessels for the multiple nations. But again, the story is going to try and be kept that it is a relief mission that flares into an exchange of fire. Both sides will try to bring it to a quick end by making political knock-outs. Those I will not put as spoilers here.

Thanks, and please bounce more thoughts and advice off of this. I want this to be a good scenario.

[magi]

Hummmm..... Well… I think the storyline in the book is strategically politically flawed… no responsible power in the right mind would even use tactical nukes… Because if you use them then the other side will use them..... And it's so hard for me to understand how you would not be in a state of war and you were simply trying to get humanitarian aid to an ally after you've had a carrier task group nuked...
I certainly believe you don't need to involve the med that's a different theater and you could just assume what's going on down there would be a logical reaction to contain France and Germany…
But unless the allies totally dominate the North Sea Baltic… I don't think it's realistic that the relief convoys could make it through… It's a chokepoint and very easy to deny and control... It would take great force to push ones wait through…
But it is a really fascinating problem… And would make a very cool scenario… i'm having fun and I'm going to keep playing it but I'm adding some stuff with the editor… however I believe I am going to initiate war… In Poland I'm going to strike and destroy the three branches as soon as I can get my aircraft into the air… I may have to give myself a little more capable assets there with the editor... I've added a couple ravens and JSTARS And I may give them a few F-15 ease for a couple of aardvarks… For the fun of it…

Gunner is really good in this theater and time period… He is far more knowledgeable than I am… You should ask him what he thinks….

[djoos5]

Well you will have a lot of work, the scenario attached has a lot of holes still.

Have fun and I look forward to any suggestions.

[djoos5]

It's been a long while, but I finally think I have a solid scenario here.

It is the first time I created one on this scale, so I would appreciate all critiques and suggestions.

I removed the custom overlays in the package due to upload size limits, but there are images. You will need to create a Cauldron folder in your Scenarios so the Descriptions and orders know where to find the pics.

The file is attached to the initial post in this thread.

[magi]

Cool... I'll check it out....

[djoos5]

Hey Magi,

If you want the overlays, let me know. I will zip them up separate and email them to you. The folder for them will go in the Cauldron scenario folder.

If you see any breakdown - please shoot me a post. I want to know if something doesn't work, make sense, or anything.

I just read through Kushan's post on his Cauldron scenario series... that might even be the way to do it - have the multiple theaters in different scenarios. I just always wonder how to tie that stuff together for wins and losses; what do you do about assets used up?

Anyway, I look forward to your comments.

DJ

[magi]

given such a capable enemy.... i believe the allies would have all our best stuff with us.....jstar.. B1s.. B2s.. more EW/OECM aircraft in poland... f16s in england..... etc etc...
if you look at this from the allied side having mission orientation view... the asset balance and disposition would be somewhat different.... currently there is a bias toward Eurcon....
i do not believ they would have all the tankers in poland where they are at risk... maybe one or two... they should be in england where they would sustain air ops...

[djoos5]

Okay - that can be done, but it would diverge from the book.

In the book, the US forces in Poland are limited to just a small group of F-16's and their crews that are there to train with the Poles. In fact, the whole book is about the retreat of the Polish forces against the newer, more powerful Rafales. I did add an F-15 group to bolster the forces assigned to Poland, but that was about it.

I kind of set it up that the US air assets have reached the UK and need to be dispersed from there - one of the reasons the mission is 10 days long, too.

In the book, too, the primary US offensive weapons come from the carriers, which are still out to see and need to be brought into range. Again, I am trying to convey the idea of build up.

If it is not working, let me know and I can think about another re-tool.

There are 'Spark-varks' in England that can be ferried to Poland. The tankers are positioned to help with the long transits (north of Germany). What other ECM/OECM craft do you think I should add?

With my above reasons for the current asset layout, let me know if you still think it should change and thanks for the input. I look forward to more!

[:D]