Christmas Truce Grinch

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Capt. Harlock
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Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by Capt. Harlock »

We are two days away from the 100th anniversary of the 1914 "Christmas Truce", when the British, French and German soldiers on the Western Front agreed to stop shooting for a day and commingle. (And even played football AKA soccer.) A number of well-meaning writers have penned essays on this, saying it shows that enemies can "recognize their common humanity" and that this somehow points the way to peace. I have to disagree.

First of all, WWI did not become more humane after the truce -- it got considerably worse. Atrocities such as unrestricted submarine warfare ("lusitania" was used as a verb for the duration of the conflict), chemical warfare, and the 20th Century's first genocide appeared. Second, as a step towards peace it went absolutely nowhere. It was never repeated, though the war would continue for three more Christmases. The thing that brought peace was waging effective war, leading to the total military defeat and dismantling of the three Central Power empires.

I am well aware of the counter-holiday-spirit of this post. But as appealing as the prospect may be, cancer is not treated by herbs but by nasty, cell-killing things like radiation and the near-poisoning known as chemotherapy. Wars are ended when one side is beaten thoroughly enough so that it loses the will to fight. And it helps immensely when the cause it was fighting for goes on the ash heap of history.
Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn't every war fought between men, between brothers?

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JWW
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by JWW »

I don't know who said it, but I heard a quote recently that said that the most humane way to wage war was to win as quickly and as decisively as possible. And that is in effect what you are saying at the end.
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warspite1
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by warspite1 »

I have not read any of the essays - do you have a link please?

From what I understand, there was little likelihood of this unofficial truce spreading further or being repeated as the top brass on both sides were fearful their men would simply end up refusing to fight. And who knows where that would lead to. So it was made clear that such fraternisation would not be tolerated in future.

If you are going to go to war, it needs to be done as the very last option because - to point out the bleedin' obvious (though sadly not obvious to some politicians) war is hideous. Total war cannot be won by pussy-footing around, and sadly (no matter how much we would like it to be otherwise) atrocities happen and they provoke atrocities from the other side.

If you are going to war - and sometimes there is no other option - expect it to be unpleasant.

Moderation in war is an absurdity said von Clausewitz.
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Aurelian
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by Aurelian »

"If you wage war, do it energetically and with severity. This is the only way to make it shorter and consequently less inhuman." Napoleon

"There is one rule in war. One must win." General Giap.
Watched a documentary on beavers. Best dam documentary I've ever seen.
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wodin
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by wodin »

Only on some parts of the front did this sort of thing happen. Where it did, once the Staff found out they soon put a stop to it. Though in a couple of sectors it went on for two days. It never happened again after 1914.

As for the War getting worse..yes it did..but that Xmas the actual soldiers in the trenches missing home and family felt more connected to the men in the opposite trenches than before.

Oh it also depended on what German troops where opposite, if it was Saxons then there would be less animosity and the front could be abit quieter whether it was Xmas or not but if it was Prussians or Bavarians it would most likely be a very active part of the front and less likely to be any friendly banter.

The Staff made sure it didn't happen again as they didn't want their men to see the enemy as decent folk as it would have a negative effect with regards to fighting spirit.

As far as atrocities go it seems shooting men surrendering or "not taking prisoners" was quite common. It was an extremely violent War if there can be such a thing with lots of hand to hand combat with sharpened spades and knobkerries plus due to the way the shells blew apart wounds and death looked far more gruesome than in WW2 where shells would splinter into much smaller pieces, still causing death but not as messy. This would have had an effect on the troops.

When you think of how soldiers today need counseling after serving in combat zones yet the men coming home from WW1 just had to get on with it when they got back.
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Orm
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by Orm »

I disagree with this but I do not want to argue about it at the moment.

I wish you all a happy holiday and a Merry Christmas.
Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb -- they're often students, for heaven's sake. - Terry Pratchett
JWW
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by JWW »

On the other hand, unofficial truces and fraternization continued between Union and Confederate troops during the Civil War right up until the end. And at the end, old friends who would have happily killed each other a few days before met and embraced and recalled old times. And as Orm said, I'm not trying to argue, just point out a different situation regarding unofficial truces. I think Capt. Harlock makes a good point about the 1914 Christmas truce.
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Lecivius
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RE: Christmas Truce Grinch

Post by Lecivius »

I'm gonna go with Orm on this. I have an opinion (who on the internet doesn't [:D] ) But no war on Christmas.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it!
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