Sweden hunting submarine

[ckfinite]

It should be noted that RT is rather unreliable whenever it comes to anything even remotely involving Russia. I prefer to wait until some other non-Russian source agrees with them from independent sourcing.

[76mm]

ORIGINAL: ckfinite
It should be noted that RT is rather unreliable whenever it comes to anything even remotely involving Russia.

er, yes, you're quite the diplomat--RT is wholly unreliable.

DirtyFred, thanks for all the fascinating reading about events from thirty years ago. Maybe you can also provide some links to Napoleonic submarine activity? Because it's about as relevant to what is going on right now...

[DirtyFred]

ORIGINAL: 76mm

ORIGINAL: ckfinite
It should be noted that RT is rather unreliable whenever it comes to anything even remotely involving Russia.

er, yes, you're quite the diplomat--RT is wholly unreliable.

DirtyFred, thanks for all the fascinating reading about events from thirty years ago. Maybe you can also provide some links to Napoleonic submarine activity? Because it's about as relevant to what is going on right now...

some of the events in the 80ies or even the 50ies and 60ies in Sweden coincide with events today - or should i say - history repeats itself

of one fact im fairly sure - it wasnt a russian sub or vessel - if its not a joke by someone it could be a US-Navy Seal or italian navy special forces or uk royal navy sas/sbs vessel on training exercise in swedish waters, german subs are all in port ...

NATO and US naval forces train in this manner to train themself to insert operatives onshore via SDVs or ASDSs - maybe it is a prototype minisub like the NR-1 (nuclear minisub and crawled on bottom left two track marks)

RT is the same as CNN .. part propaganda and part (mis)information

any pro subber would not make the mistake surfacing in daylight and near the shore so what is this? and sweden was traumatized by the sub incursions of the 80ies - so why do this op now? today sweden is very pro-US so why rattle their cage?

btw read the book (attachment1). even most swedish citizens dont know they were psyopped in the 80ies

[DirtyFred]

ORIGINAL: bradinggs

Looking forward to giving it a read, thanks DirtyFred.

youre welcome

[Tomcat84]

ORIGINAL: DirtyFred


of one fact im fairly sure - it wasnt a russian sub or vessel -

because ?

[76mm]

ORIGINAL: DirtyFred
of one fact im fairly sure - it wasnt a russian sub or vessel

Don't see why you're so sure? You might be right, but I am willing to wait for some facts before I make up my mind.

ORIGINAL: DirtyFred
and sweden was traumatized by the sub incursions of the 80ies - so why do this op now? today sweden is very pro-US so why rattle their cage?

Because maybe, just maybe, the US has nothing to do with this?

ORIGINAL: DirtyFred
RT is the same as CNN .. part propaganda and part (mis)information

I'm no real fan of CNN but RT is in a totally different league.

[AlmightyTallest]

Trying to piece what's actually happening and I found this:

http://twitter.com/rConflictNews/status/523817861438242816/photo/1

RU survey vessel 'Professor Logachev' appears to be sailing towards the area where a sub is allegedly in distress.

Then later on: http://twitter.com/rConflictNews/status/523819534684532737/photo/1

The Professor Logachev is being directly shadowed by the Dutch Navy vessel HNLMS Zeeland

http://www.inquisitr.com/1550664/russian-submarine-found-in-sweden-russia-linked-to-photo-of-foreign-vessel/

Other developments also took place on Sunday, with the presence of Russian-owned, Liberian-flagged oil tanker NS Concord being connected in the local media with the potential Russian submarine. The tanker was seen criss-crossing the seas off Sweden, which seemed odd to reporters, but Anders Nordin at the Swedish Coastguard claims these movement were normal for a tanker. Reports also note that a Russian research vessel, the Professor Logachev, is heading toward Sweden, and it is equipped for underwater search operations.
Read more at http://www.inquisitr.com/1550664/russia ... AllbPYt.99

My guess is a Russian submarine in some distress, or it simply got caught in the act.

[BradOrbital]

I've searched back though and seen that the Professor Logachev vessel has been used for various seismic research for UK and other nations. In a light search I couldn't find any recent universities or governments using it at the moment.

[AlmightyTallest]

This all reminded me of this song from the 80's

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x20zau_thomas-dolby-one-of-our-submarines_music

[BradOrbital]

Expanding the search to outer islands and southwards.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-29 ... ws_central

Dutch sub possibility being dismissed by navy.

A brief analysis of the NS Concord and the Professor on a tracking site.
http://www.fleetmon.com/newsroom/2014/5 ... and-scf-t/

Currently I can't find NS Concord, appears either out of signal range or AIS is off again.

Amazed that NS Concord is already on Wikipedia claiming it's part of the sub hunt... before all the facts are out.

[Casinn]

Read somewhere that the Dutch sub was in Estonia at the time of photos

[BradOrbital]

Yeah, it was already docked at an Estonian port but someone said "oh there could be another one" so I guess the media went with it.

[DeltaIV]

Hello guys,

i can relate to DirtyFred's postings -- namely that he mentioned Ola Tunander.

This author wrote probably most comprehensive study on this matter - The Secret War Against Sweden, mapping the foreign incursions into Swedish territorial waters. The book is excellent and a must if you are interested in this matter. It's very interesting to see how far west went in the struggle to erode Swedish neutrality.

For the rest, it's just safe to say that world's news media is probably working better than Swedish navy, because it seems that they already know much more.

[BradOrbital]

Hi DeltaIV, haven't gone through The Secret War Against Sweden yet but hopefully tomorrow, it certainly is interesting.

With the media, I've found that reading the comments from the navy and military seem to be providing the clearest picture. Latest article has a number of them:
The Local, a newspaper in Sweden giving good coverage -> http://www.thelocal.se/20141020/stockho ... in-russian

The military hasn't mentioned Russia and are clear on that, so they could be thinking Western powers but not saying so to keep the peace but probably some diplomatic channels lighting up behind the scenes if that is the case.

Military say they now calling it an "intelligence gathering operation" and not a sub hunt.

Great pictures well all getting though! [:D]

[AlmightyTallest]

If the below report is true, they may have the vessel pinned down.

http://www.interpretermag.com/ukraine-liveblog-day-246-submarines-gas-deals-and-human-rights/#4680

Sweden Ready To Use Force Against Suspected Russian Submarine
13:59 (GMT)

After five days of searching fora "foreign vessel" in Swedish waters, the Swedish military is threatening to use weapons, if necessary, to surface the vessel. Since many suspect that the unidentified submerged object could be a Russian submarine, such a statement is certainly a significant escalation in rhetoric.

The Local, an English-language Swedish newspaper, reports:

When asked how the Armed Forces would manage to get the suspected foreign submarine to the surface, Commander Sverker Göranson responded:

"With weapons, if need be."

His comments to the Swedish media came after a nearly two-hour long meeting with Sweden's defence committee behind closed doors.

They also followed reports in the Dagens Nyheter newspaper that there had been more than 100 reported sightings of a suspect vessel from members of the public in the past day or so.

Either way, I'm curious to see how this pans out.

[mazex]

Inspired by the Sub hunt in the Swedish waters that bring back cold war memories I remembered a Beta Scenario I did during the Beta of CMANO... I only think I posted it in the closed dev sub forum.

The settings is a 1991 invasion of southern Sweden by USSR after a fictional coup by the old school generals...

I just uploaded the last version to the scenarios sub forum - It's just a Beta but if you like the setting it may be fun to try:

tm.asp?m=3721494&mpage=1&key=&#3721494

[DirtyFred]

If ... if it is a russian minisub (a prototype?) there should be a mother-uboat in international waters. Same applies for other nations.

btw if the russians want SIGINT data, they send their Tu-95 Bombers with SIGINT gear ... as they have done in 2013. why risk a sub or minisub?


my guess its the successor of NR-1 ... lets call it NR-2.

a good book to read about NR-1:
http://www.amazon.com/Dark-Waters-Insid ... 0451211618

It was impossibly expensive, extraordinarily dangerous, and as a secret weapon, completely unarmed. For the American military, the state-of-the-art submersible, christened NR-1, would be the most closely guarded-and revolutionary-secret of the Cold War. The pet project of Admiral Hyman Rickover, the father of the nuclear Navy, the 400-ton submarine with a miniature nuclear reactor was designed to dive deeper than any other submarine. But such depths also meant the crew would be cut off from all possible rescue should something go wrong. Now, the full story of the NR-1 is told for the first time through eyewitness accounts by the original crew-including co-author Lee Vyborny-who dared go where no men had gone before.

[DirtyFred]

one fairly interesting analysis:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/10/22/ ... in-sweden/

in relation:
http://www.aco.nato.int/-nato-air-polic ... c-sea.aspx

The aircraft was identified as a Russian IL-20 (intelligence collection aircraft). The Russian IL-20 took off from Kaliningrad and commenced flying over the Baltic Sea towards Denmark. The Russian aircraft was first intercepted by Danish F-16’s and as the IL-20 headed further north it was intercepted by fighters from Sweden. The Russian aircraft headed south again and Portuguese F-16’s were scrambled. At 12:53 p.m. CET the IL-20 approached Estonian airspace from the northeast. The Russian aircraft entered Estonian airspace near the island of Saaremaa for a period of less than one minute, which represented an incursion of about 600 meters into NATO airspace.

Portuguese F-16’s made visual contact with the IL-20 and escorted it until it was further away from NATO airspace. NATO jets assigned to the Baltic Air Policing Mission were available throughout the duration of the Russian flight and the IL-20 was continually tracked using Allied assets on the ground and in the air.

Scrambles and intercepts are standard procedure when an unknown aircraft approaches NATO airspace. However, such flights pose a potential risk to civil aviation given that the Russian military often do not file flight plans, or use their on-board transponders. This means civilian air traffic control cannot detect these aircraft nor ensure there is no interference with civilian air traffic.

[DeltaIV]

Thanks for the link. This is first analysis that makes sense.

[safedisk]

I Agree. There has been a constant parading of bogeymen for the last decade, Al Quaeda, the Taliban, the Russians and finally ISIS.
All can be solved with the same magic formula.
More spending on Weapons.
Russia is right, war is coming.
It might be in one year or ten, but with the constant build up of the capabilities of the worlds armed forces something will happen eventually to kick it all off.

PS. Why does the UK need two 65000 ton aircraft carriers? These things will be very expensive to run/maintain and what is it going to do with them?
Needed for WW3?