HOI 4 disappointing preview

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aaatoysandmore
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by aaatoysandmore »

[:D]
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terje439
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by terje439 »

ORIGINAL: wodin

Well CK2 is one of my fav games and the coming DLC sounds superb..also EU IV is fun and that coming DLC also sounds superb..so I wouldn't say they are going downhill fast. AS for HOI being for kids..well it's beyond me to be honest. Infact I find the series one of the most complex grand strat wargames out there..

Have you exported your CK2 game into EU4? Just curious how well that works.
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pzgndr
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by pzgndr »

Will there be a Bolt mod for HOI 4? Haha. I got so fed up with HOI and Paradox years ago and moved on. I don't pay attention to them anymore.
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gradenko2k
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by gradenko2k »

ORIGINAL: gexmex
I guess it was more the way it was handled than anything. I just felt strung along for nothing. I didn't know about leaked betas, it seemed like everything was moving in the right direction. All I ever got to see were screenshots, so I know nothing.

The internet has sort of caused a shift in how much developers allow players to peek into gaming development, with things like developer diaries and forum discussions and straight-from-the-developer's-mouth tweets; if the developer wants to, we can see a whole lot more than the occasional preview from a 90s gaming magazine.

At the same time, it's important to note that only the most indie and the most candid of developers are ever going to tell you that things are not going well in their development, so it's important to be able to read between the lines.

With East vs West, it wasn't really all that surprising: all of the developer diaries focused on combat and production minutiae that really shouldn't matter at all. The devs tell us that you can totally customize your carrier's armament between a dozen different types of anti-aircraft cannon, and they went on and on about the strategic importance of straits (in New Zealand no less!), but we never heard a peep about diplomacy or guerrilla warfare or proxy wars or the smallest smidgen of actual Cold War politics.

Couple that with their "let's crowdsource leaders from forumgoers" campaign and the last minute change to beta access and it was rather predictable that it wouldn't have been a good game even if Paradox allowed it to be published.
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by undercovergeek »

ORIGINAL: bairdlander
ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore


I cannot rate the Paradox games or even the Creative Assembly games above that level though.
I'd have to put Paradox and Creative Assembly games in the "entry" level editions with a slight edge toward "intermediate" level of play but nothing like a WitP or WitE or World in Flames for sure. Even TOAW III I would rate very high toward the advanced catagory. Battles in Normandy, Battles in Italy, even Ajoed games I'd rate a lot higher. So, while they may all be titled kiddie games in the sence you are promoting there are "levels" of kiddie games and that's where Paradox and Creative Assembly games stand now.
I wouldn't call the EU series,Victoria series or HOI series "entry" level strategy games.Have you ever tried any?Can you tell us which ones and the reason you consider them "entry" level strategy titles?[&:][&:][&:][&:]

the silence since the rant speaks volumes - im going to go out on a ledge and guess at not a lot have been played

its ok aaatoysandmore, you and everyone else is allowed to play games Matrix didnt make [8|]
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by undercovergeek »

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore
Having done all this ranting....I'm sure I'll cave at some point in the future and buy it when it goes on sale. I'm a sucker like that.

Even I do that from time to time. I even caved and bought HOI III for $4.99 on Gamersgate I think it were. As I recall though HOI III was a mess at release (Japan invades France or was it Finland I forget) and within weeks it was $3.99. That's the 2nd game they've made that got horrible reviews and went extremely down in price after release. Who doesn't remember Victoria at .99 cents just a few weeks after release?

But, seriously if anyone ever wonders why I call it a kids game or childs toy just play Brazil. I was able to conquer South America, build up an amphibious invasion force, invade up throught the boot of Italy, take over northern Africa and the first to march into Berlin. With Brazil now the saviour of the world lol. While it may have some detailed and complex elements it doesn't take away what a child might want to see happen in a WWII game. Hell, lets build a navy on the Fiji islands and sink the bismark while Johnny Horton sings in the background. [:D]

total rubbish

you wouldnt get a Cassus Belli against the Axis and you wouldnt have the manpower as Brazil to do it
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by bairdlander2 »

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek

ORIGINAL: aaatoysandmore
Having done all this ranting....I'm sure I'll cave at some point in the future and buy it when it goes on sale. I'm a sucker like that.

Even I do that from time to time. I even caved and bought HOI III for $4.99 on Gamersgate I think it were. As I recall though HOI III was a mess at release (Japan invades France or was it Finland I forget) and within weeks it was $3.99. That's the 2nd game they've made that got horrible reviews and went extremely down in price after release. Who doesn't remember Victoria at .99 cents just a few weeks after release?

But, seriously if anyone ever wonders why I call it a kids game or childs toy just play Brazil. I was able to conquer South America, build up an amphibious invasion force, invade up throught the boot of Italy, take over northern Africa and the first to march into Berlin. With Brazil now the saviour of the world lol. While it may have some detailed and complex elements it doesn't take away what a child might want to see happen in a WWII game. Hell, lets build a navy on the Fiji islands and sink the bismark while Johnny Horton sings in the background. [:D]

total rubbish

you wouldnt get a Cassus Belli against the Axis and you wouldnt have the manpower as Brazil to do it
+1 on that,I don't think he has ever played HOI3.And it was not $3.99 weeks after release,what bs.[:-][:-]
CarlVon
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by CarlVon »

I agree...

Not for kids: fb.asp?m=3438050
:-)
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geozero
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by geozero »

ORIGINAL: M J R

I agree with you there Wodin, CK2, EUIII, EUIV i can play, not expertly, but understand and enjoy them.
Hearts Of Iron II and III i have tried over the years but they give me a head ache.
The new version oh Hearts Of Iron looks like something i might be able to wrap my head around :)


I am sooo looking forward to HOI 4.

I own EVERY Paradox game, and for the HOI franchise literally everything that has come out, except some mods.

HOI 3 is a Pain the @$$. It's so bloated you cannot play more than a few turns... maybe I am getting adult ADD. But it is just not a fun game. Making History 2 is better, but not as in depth.

Watching the videos for HOI 4... I can't wait. It's not about being prettier, though certainly a cleaner GUI and better graphics are always welcome. It's about playability... if you want to be so in depth that it take 3 hours to decide where to invade Poland then it's not for me. I think the developer has done an exemplary job at making the game better, faster, more accessible AND still have depth for the hard core gamers.

Just my 2 cents.
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hubin
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by hubin »

After witp and witp ae there is no place in my heart for thinie stiupid para... games or doxes.

Personnaly iam waiting for more Close combat's, steel panthers games like, witp/witpae/wpo, beyond the matrix there is only combat mission.
Main stream games are terrible and geting worse...
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geozero
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by geozero »

My only beef with Close Combat games is that there has not been much in the way of GUI and graphics updates. You are still watching tiny sprites move (sprites from probably the 1980's era). Replace it with a better graphics representation, a MAP and GAME editor and you will have a winner. But instead they will dish out another "battle" every 18-24 months and take another chunk of your savings. Not going down that road anymore. :)
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Goodmongo
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by Goodmongo »

First off East vs. West was being developed by BL Logic. I know because I worked on the team that created EvW. It was being published by PI. I won't go into the reason why it was cancelled but I will say that there are no plans whatsoever of bringing it back using HOI4.

I've played many a Matrix game and many a PDS game. They each have their good and bad points. But playing WitP can take many months to finish and it also basically comes down to the critical battle that determines the fate of the Pacific.

HOI3 had it's share of problems and vanilla was just terrible. But the expansions through TFH has come a long way. I still don't know why plasticpanzers says his subs can't sink ships. CV's in an unmodded game are immune but BB's aren't. And having help a little with BICE I know subs can sink almost anything.

So it really comes down to what you want to do. I have lot's of faith for HOI4 but I can't go there because of restrictions. But I do want to say that the things plasticpanzers ahs posted are not true. Much of what is posted in the forums is reviewed. Just because maybe his desires aren't implemented doesn't mean that others are ignored. After all he may want to do something one way and other users prefer option B. Someone will be disappointed. Doesn't mean both weren't considered.
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by Hadadad »

ORIGINAL: M J R

If you were referring to the East Vs West game that got cancelled in favor of getting HOI IV out the door i was told by a friend who follows Paradox rather closely that the East Vs West will be released later on down the line as an expansion for HOI IV.
Maybe you will get the game after all.....
Umm I do believe your friend has some misinformation

EvW was being developed by a 3rd party, BL Logic that did Arsenal of Democracy, not PDS which is who is developing HOI4 so there was no overlap of resources for getting one out the door versus the other for development staff.

Edit... Missed the last post by Goodmongo...I have a feeling I know him ;)

Also there are a few mods that can make HOI3 more challenging and immersive.


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Rising-Sun
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by Rising-Sun »

Well I wont pay fifty us dollars for that game, but if it really worth it and did some serious change and improvements then I might reconsider. Just so many games aren't worth more than fifty bucks.

For example, here in Matrix, they are greedy as hell. Believe I bought four games and only like two of them, other two sucks!

So before buying something I recommend do some research and maybe they will have a demo for it. Customer reviews and youtube/Wikipedia may help you as well.
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by geozero »

I think Matrix holds the record on the most expensive games, up there close to $100 bucks.

As for cost... I always use my cost vs. enjoyment factor ratio analysis... it goes like this:

Entertainment is worth approx. $8 per hour (cost of a movie+popcorn, cost of amusement park per hour, etc.) - you can use whatever "factor" you want.

So... a game costing $50 should get you at LEAST 6-7 hours. HOI4 will likely get you closer to 35-50 hours of game time. That's a great bargain.

Hope that helps ease the pain of paying for a solid game. [:D]
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Aurelian
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by Aurelian »

ORIGINAL: geozero

I think Matrix holds the record on the most expensive games, up there close to $100 bucks.


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gradenko2k
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by gradenko2k »

Relevant to Paradox, Crusader Kings 2 just hit over 1 million copies sold

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/sho ... opies-Sold
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battlevonwar
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by battlevonwar »

Why are you knocking a company that is worth 200 something Million apparently they did something right. Of course some other company could fill in the fringe of what they left behind. I think that the games are more multiplayer in regards to HOI4 engine. Though HOI3 and Vicky series were just impossible...too large...

It is a game, period. All these are make believe. Reality, never... I enjoy every level of gaming. Though you can destroy a good thing if you're not careful! HOI3 gives me a headache was boring and took away player customization (I didn't try the mods mind you) but everyone loves their own kind of game. I like almost anything that is entertaining to me...

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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by Karri »

Much can also be said of the interface improvements that Paradox has brought to strategy games. Compared to some Matrix games where you need to have a whole room full of operational papers to reference what's going on the Paradox games are a godsent.
aaatoysandmore
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RE: HOI 4 disappointing preview

Post by aaatoysandmore »

ORIGINAL: Werewolf1326

HOI4 is on my list.

I for one am sick of games that require a freaking spreadsheet to play.

Wanna spend all your time trying to figure out if that 5-4-5 armored division in concert with the 3-3-3 Inf div one in and one out of supply moving across a river in winter can successfully attack that 2-2-2 Inf div defending who just happens to have a CAS sqdn in support??? Really? Knock yourselves out.

Personally - at age 30 going into the weeds to shake out the details was okay. AT 62 its getting old (and so am I).

I find the direction Paradox is going with HOI4 refreshing. HOI3 is pretty good but the level of detail one must deal with to play it with any hope of success is time consuming, boring and frankly a real pain in the ass!


I believe there is a quote out there that does say "Twiced a child" before we die. So, I can see why you'd want something simple at your late older age. [:'(]
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