My second AAR (again)

[composer99]

Oooh, an Essex-class CV going into the Construction Pool!

[brian brian]

ORIGINAL: yvesp

The US are elated at the story of the heroic British soldiers going to defend Spain.
A new chit is drawn.

Why would the US get a chit on a turn that didn't include the DOW on Spain?

[yvesp]

ORIGINAL: brian brian

ORIGINAL: yvesp

The US are elated at the story of the heroic British soldiers going to defend Spain.
A new chit is drawn.

Why would the US get a chit on a turn that didn't include the DOW on Spain?

Because there are four allied corps in Spain I guess.

But it should not, because this should happen "on the turn war was declared" condition which doesn't exist now. It should have only happened on the previous turn when war was declared : this looks like another bug. That's if one read the RAC or RAW.

Now, if one read the Wif original tables, the "on the turn war was declared" condition doesn't exist ; it is replaced by "roll once for each country".

There is an ambiguity there and I'm usure about which takes precedence. I must admit that I have always used the tables interpretation (and allowed support to happen in later turns.)

[yvesp]

ORIGINAL: composer99

Oooh, an Essex-class CV going into the Construction Pool!

Well... I guess that most US player have this at this precise date ?

[Courtenay]

ORIGINAL: yvesp

ORIGINAL: composer99

Oooh, an Essex-class CV going into the Construction Pool!

Well... I guess that most US player have this at this precise date ?

No. Many US players have five Essex class go into the pool at this precise date. See the '98 Annual for how to pull this off. (Hint: save BPs early as the US.) Of course, to do this one should not have the horrible US entry that this game has had.

[Courtenay]

ORIGINAL: yvesp

Because there are four allied corps in Spain I guess.

But it should not, because this should happen "on the turn war was declared" condition which doesn't exist now. It should have only happened on the previous turn when war was declared : this looks like another bug. That's if one read the RAC or RAW.

Now, if one read the Wif original tables, the "on the turn war was declared" condition doesn't exist ; it is replaced by "roll once for each country".

There is an ambiguity there and I'm usure about which takes precedence. I must admit that I have always used the tables interpretation (and allowed support to happen in later turns.)

The RAW should take precedence over the chart, but I must admit that I did not remember the "on the turn war declared" either.

[yvesp]

ORIGINAL: Courtenay

ORIGINAL: yvesp

ORIGINAL: composer99

Oooh, an Essex-class CV going into the Construction Pool!

Well... I guess that most US player have this at this precise date ?

No. Many US players have five Essex class go into the pool at this precise date. See the '98 Annual for how to pull this off. (Hint: save BPs early as the US.) Of course, to do this one should not have the horrible US entry that this game has had.

I would not go that way.
It assumes that you will need 5 carriers to keep the Japanese in check, and that's not something I feel necessary. IMHO, while it certainly gives the Japanese pause to think about, it doesn't help much. I rather prefer having an adequate, smaller fleet, and a bolder Japanese who will risk his fleet: the US may suffer losses, but the Japanese will, too.

Building all Essex together requires 25BP (for the carriers) and 15BP (for the planes) ; it also requires using BPs for bringing up the ship building limit to 5, two times. I've not tried to pull such a thing, but it certainly means that you don't build up some other units which I believe are more useful: marines, headquarters, paratroops, some land units, navs... One more carrier means one less marine+TRS unit... or one less para+air transport... There is a trade off and I feel these units give more versatility and let indeed prosecute the war: sea control will not win the war, even though loss of sea control will lose it!

The only case where I'd consider such a strategy is when the Japanese are doing so well that they build like crazy, say 16BP per turn instead of about 12BP per turn. Assuming they suffer few losses in China. The other case of course would be an early US gear up, which leaves lots of leaway about production. Neither is my situation in this game.

Here, the Japanese have laid down many carriers, but the focus on China is such that more than half are actually unmanned... At this stage, this is working rather well: the Chinese are affraid of attacking, for fear a a powerfull counterattack. Now, Japan can spend about half of its production on non land units, and soon the land force pool will be on the map: this will achieve a strategic goal, ensure a stalemate in China and Manchuria, so that the next phase which will involve the navy, can proceed with as little interference as possible. Even the Russians are annoyed, because a war in Mandchuria might end up being long for so little gain!

So, the Japanese fleet matches the US fleet. It is in no way really better, or worse. And most of the time, the Japanese head west at the start of the hostilities, to seize the Netherland east-indies and malaysia: 6 easy to pick resources! More US carriers don't help that much, because these attacks are usually prosecuted rather quickly, before the new US fleet can be operationnal (Sept/Oct 42, counting a movement to position itself in a useful place.)

[yvesp]

Once more, the axis loses the initiative, after reroll.
Germany expected a combined which would have let it exploit the relative weakness of the convoy chain while at the same time advancing in Spain. This will not be!

[Centuur]

ORIGINAL: Courtenay

ORIGINAL: yvesp

Because there are four allied corps in Spain I guess.

But it should not, because this should happen "on the turn war was declared" condition which doesn't exist now. It should have only happened on the previous turn when war was declared : this looks like another bug. That's if one read the RAC or RAW.

Now, if one read the Wif original tables, the "on the turn war was declared" condition doesn't exist ; it is replaced by "roll once for each country".

There is an ambiguity there and I'm usure about which takes precedence. I must admit that I have always used the tables interpretation (and allowed support to happen in later turns.)

The RAW should take precedence over the chart, but I must admit that I did not remember the "on the turn war declared" either.

Yes, it's a bug. Is there the possibility of putting the saved game in the Tech support forum? It needs correction, since the US shouldn't get a draw if the Allies don't get the four corps in Spain in the same turn it gets DoW'ed...

Here is RAW:

21. Allies support attacked minor - the Allies have supported an
attacked minor country if there are at least 4 Allied corps or
armies in the minor’s unconquered home country during the
Allied minor support step of the same turn an Axis major power
declared war on it. Soviet units in east Poland don’t count and
neither do the minor’s own units.

[yvesp]

The Russian invent a new tactic to punish the resistance of Bagdad.
It is destroyed by bombs, so that units can now freely move around.
Considering the weather, it might be the only way to capture Irak this turn!

[yvesp]

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Yes, it's a bug. Is there the possibility of putting the saved game in the Tech support forum? It needs correction, since the US shouldn't get a draw if the Allies don't get the four corps in Spain in the same turn it gets DoW'ed...

Here is RAW:

21. Allies support attacked minor - the Allies have supported an
attacked minor country if there are at least 4 Allied corps or
armies in the minor’s unconquered home country during the
Allied minor support step of the same turn an Axis major power
declared war on it. Soviet units in east Poland don’t count and
neither do the minor’s own units.

I'll send it to Steve.

[yvesp]

While the German army advances through the pyreneans, avoiding combat during snow, the Japanese still try to capture Changsa by running around.
The Chinese troops hold fast.

[yvesp]

But north of Canton, the Chinese are broken and the Japanses can get trhough the river. However, the Chinese still hold the mountains.

[composer99]

Carpet bombing for the win! You don't often see it in play.

[yvesp]

The Germans are slowed by the rain and the persistent presence of enemy units. They will try and enlarge the passage, with the objective of capturing Barcelona This would open up the possibility of rail movements near the front line.

[yvesp]

ORIGINAL: composer99

Carpet bombing for the win! You don't often see it in play.

Yes. It is often a lucky shot that falls on the wrong target.

In this case, the weather prevented any attack. It was as chancy to carpet bomb or to wait for a clear weather impulse... With the advantage that the carpet bombing, if successful, would let the armies to proceed unhindered.

I do this often in the end game with the US bombers ; but its not often that it succeeds well.

[yvesp]

Barcelona is now isolated.

[yvesp]

And in China the Japanese are closing on the railway line.
Unfortunately, the Chinese chose a blitz, and the motorized unit had to be destroyed!

[Courtenay]

ORIGINAL: yvesp

And in China the Japanese are closing on the railway line.
Unfortunately, the Chinese chose a blitz, and the motorized unit had to be destroyed!

If the Chinese had chosen assault, the Japanese would have had to lose three units, which is worse.

[yvesp]

ORIGINAL: Courtenay

ORIGINAL: yvesp

And in China the Japanese are closing on the railway line.
Unfortunately, the Chinese chose a blitz, and the motorized unit had to be destroyed!

If the Chinese had chosen assault, the Japanese would have had to lose three units, which is worse.

I did not check, but you're certainly right. So for once, the axis powers are lucky in their persistent bad luck.