Why the first world war wasn't

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decaro
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Why the first world war wasn't

Post by decaro »

"THE world—or, at least, those parts of it that participated in the original events—has recently taken great interest in the first world war. Its almost casual beginning, between June 28th 1914, when the heir to the throne of Austria-Hungary was assassinated by a Bosnian nationalist and the first days of August, when Germany declared war on Russia and France, drawing in their ally Britain, has fascinated historians, while the horrors that followed have fascinated everyone, though in a rather different way. But does the conflict deserve its title? It was undoubtedly a world war. But it was certainly not the first. That laurel belongs to a war which broke out 160 years earlier, in 1754, and carried on until 1763. Though fighting did not start in Europe until 1756, and for this reason the conflict is known as the Seven Years’ War, it was truly global. Every inhabited continent except Australia saw fighting on its soil, and independent powers on three of those continents were active participants ..."

http://www.economist.com/blogs/economis ... rdwarwasnt

I think The French and Indian War(s), 1689-1763, were the colonial aspect of this global conflict, but this really gets confusing.

"Queen Anne's War (1702–1713), as the North American theater of the War of the Spanish Succession was known in the British colonies, was the second in a series of French and Indian Wars fought between France and England, later Great Britain, in North America for control of the continent. The War of the Spanish Succession was primarily fought in Europe. In addition to the two main combatants, the war also involved numerous Native American tribes allied with each nation, and Spain, which was allied with France. It was also known as the Third Indian War ..."

http://www.ask.com/wiki/Queen_Anne's_Wa ... ap=ask.com

If anyone can simply explain all this, please fell free, otherwise see AGEOD's "Wars in America" because there certainly were a lot of them.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by Gilmer »

Yes I have heard the 7 Years War often referred to as the true first World War.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by Aurelian »

Depends on your definition of world war. I guess.
 
Fought all over the world?
 
Fought in the known world? (Just about any Roman war for example.)
 
Fought by the known major powers? (Which then depends on the definition of major power. Or such power known to whom.)
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by decaro »

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

Depends on your definition of world war. I guess.

Fought all over the world?

Fought in the known world? (Just about any Roman war for example.)

Fought by the known major powers? (Which then depends on the definition of major power. Or such power known to whom.)

Merriam-Webster

A war involving many nations of the world; a war engaged in by all or most of the principal nations of the world.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by gradenko2k »

It's worth noting that the term "World War I" or "First World War" only came to being after the fact. Americans called it "The European War" and didn't graduate to "World War" until they themselves entered it in 1917. Britons preferred the term "The Great War" until the 1940s. The differentiation of it and the SECOND World War did not enter public consciousness until FDR started referring to it as such after Pearl Harbor.

Perhaps the earliest use of the phrase "world war" was as a literal translation of the German "weltkrieg", particularly in reference to the system of alliances between the Great Powers at the turn of the 20th century. Even by the first decade of that century people could already predict that nations were so interlocked that a general war would involve multiple Great Powers and would span multiple continents.

All that said, the Seven Years War itself wouldn't be the only one that's world-war-worthy. The Napoleonic Wars, for example, were just as inclusive in terms of participants.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by Shellshock »

If one had to come up with a epic slogan--"Never before have so many given so much for so little."--would seem appropriate.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by decaro »

ORIGINAL: gradenko_2000
... All that said, the Seven Years War itself wouldn't be the only one that's world-war-worthy. The Napoleonic Wars, for example, were just as inclusive in terms of participants.

OK, but the point of the article was that the Seven Years War was the first world war, not the only world war prior to the first world war.

According to Wiki, the Napoleonic Wars (1803–1815) were a series of conflicts between Napoleon's French Empire and a series of opposing coalitions led by Great Britain, though it's difficult to tell when the conflicts resulting from the French Revolution ended and the Napoleonic wars began.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by TulliusDetritus »

Well, I don't think I agree with the thesis [:)]

In WWI the world was really controlled by Europeans (that's why it deserves the "world" label). In the XVIII century the Europeans had basically grabbed only the Americas. There were trading posts -as the article correctly defines them- in many other parts of the world but they were only that, trading posts. So Africa out (only overrun in the XIX when quinine was available). Asia out as well.

If we still affirm it's a "world" thing then basically any conflict involving let's say the Portuguese, Spaniards, English, Dutch and French (they were controlling chunks of land outside of Europe: real colonies and then trading posts) was per definition a World War. And this since the 1500s or 1600s.

And these conflicts did indeed appear.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by TulliusDetritus »

And by the way, yesterday I bought Rise of Prussia Gold edition

It is not a coincidence that the AGEOD guys (who truly respect history in their games) focus on Europe, are leaving colonies and trading posts out.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by decaro »

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

Well, I don't think I agree with the thesis [:)]

In WWI the world was really controlled by Europeans (that's why it deserves the "world" label). In the XVIII century the Europeans had basically grabbed only the Americas. There were trading posts -as the article correctly defines them- in many other part of the world but they were only that, trading posts. So Africa out (only overrun in the XIX when quinine was available). Asia out as well.

In India the outbreak of the Seven Years' War renewed the conflict between French and British trading companies in the region for influence; the conflict spread beyond southern India and into Bengal, where British forces under Robert Clive recaptured Calcutta from a French ally and ousted him from his throne at the Battle of Plassey in 1757. In the same year the British also captured the French settlement in Bengal at Chandernagar.

Spanish forces led by don Pedro Antonio de Cevallos, Governor of Buenos Aires launched a campaign against the Portuguese in South America. The Portuguese territories of Colonia do Sacramento and Rio Grande de São Pedro were conquered by the Spaniards and the Portuguese forces were forced to surrender and retreat. The Colonia of Sacramento and the near territories were under Spanish control until the Treaty of Paris (1763).
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by TulliusDetritus »

These campaigns, battles are not different from previous wars fought by the colonial powers mentioned above [:)]

Look at the pic: early 1600s. Dutch vs Portuguese.

IIRC the Dutch had bribed the Portuguese governor or boss in Malacca. When they stormed the place, they should have given him the thirty pieces of silver, but instead they rushed to assassinate him [:D] A cheap coup de main

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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by decaro »

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

These campaigns, battles are not different from previous wars fought by the colonial powers mentioned above ...

... but as they were "global" in scope and renewed by the larger war in Europe, IMO these conflicts should qualify the Seven Years War as a world war in both its geography and number of participants.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by Mobius »

The Revolutionary War was part of a bigger war (at least for the English) that involved United States, England, France, Spain and the Dutch Republic.
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by Citizen Emperor »

First World War - The Seven Years War (1756-63)
Second World War - The Napoleonic Wars (1800-15)
Third World War - World War I (1914-18)
Fourth World War - World War II (1939-45)

Let's just hope there's never a "Fifth World War"...
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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by Orm »

Would not the Mongol invasions or wars qualify with your definitions?


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RE: Why the first world war wasn't

Post by z1812 »

ORIGINAL: Citizen Emperor

First World War - The Seven Years War (1756-63)
Second World War - The Napoleonic Wars (1800-15)
Third World War - World War I (1914-18)
Fourth World War - World War II (1939-45)

Let's just hope there's never a "Fifth World War"...


The above seems right.
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