EDBTR Database Project

[Denniss]

What always wondered me in the old BTR is the availability of the Fw 190F and G aircraft and units, the F was a heavily armored ground attack variant and not suitable for intercepting bombers, the G a long range fighter-bomber (although could be used vs bombers but lacked a bit firepower).
The Fw 190F was even more strange as it could be equipped with four rocket launchers vs the two in realworld.

Was there any change to this in the Matrix version?

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: rob89

Anyone know the meaning and the use of the data in the 'Device Sheet' (load, range, effect, penetration, etc.), regarding factory types

Hi Rob,

it is important to activate macros in the editor.
If you do that, you could see in the top rows of the 'device sheet' that some values changes
from i.e. 'range' to 'production type' etc..., if you select factory machine types.
The meaning of i.e. 'production type' is:

Value 1: can produce frames
Value 2: can produce parts
Value 3: can produce engines

(Gary has a special liking for defining some variables twice. [:'(] )

If you have more questions feel free to ask more precisely again. [:)]

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: rob89

@Creeper

Is the little box in the 'Location Sheet' with the data of fuel/oil stocks working or not. If yes, how ?

Thank you in advance

Yes, this box is working, but only if you are able to load a savegame file (and you're not...sorry).
IIRC, you can't load a savegame file, because there is the possibility to cheat in PBEM-games.
So, that function was removed from the editor.

But it would be really interesting to see how the fuel-/oil storage situation of the defender side
developes every turn.

Hmmm... TaggedYa, Turner, Stoneage... send me your savegame files [;)]

[rob89]

ORIGINAL: Creeper

ORIGINAL: rob89

Anyone know the meaning and the use of the data in the 'Device Sheet' (load, range, effect, penetration, etc.), regarding factory types

Hi Rob,

it is important to activate macros in the editor.
If you do that, you could see in the top rows of the 'device sheet' that some values changes
from i.e. 'range' to 'production type' etc..., if you select factory machine types.
The meaning of i.e. 'production type' is:

Value 1: can produce frames
Value 2: can produce parts
Value 3: can produce engines

(Gary has a special liking for defining some variables twice. [:'(] )

If you have more questions feel free to ask more precisely again. [:)]

Thank you very much (and above all for the Editor)

So, I see the data but I have a doubt too : the number under column penetration, that for 'Assembly', 'Engines' & 'Parts' has different values (btw 5 and 90).
What's the meaning and use ? Is it related to the R&D function ?
(i.e. : the R&D function is not simply linear : 100*number of months in advance)

thanks

Rob

[rob89]

ORIGINAL: Creeper

ORIGINAL: rob89

@Creeper

Is the little box in the 'Location Sheet' with the data of fuel/oil stocks working or not. If yes, how ?

Thank you in advance

Yes, this box is working, but only if you are able to load a savegame file (and you're not...sorry).
IIRC, you can't load a savegame file, because there is the possibility to cheat in PBEM-games.
So, that function was removed from the editor.

But it would be really interesting to see how the fuel-/oil storage situation of the defender side
developes every turn.

Hmmm... TaggedYa, Turner, Stoneage... send me your savegame files [;)]

It's very sad [;)]

Those data are very important ...

[Turner]

ORIGINAL: Creeper

But it would be really interesting to see how the fuel-/oil storage situation of the defender side
developes every turn.

Hmmm... TaggedYa, Turner, Stoneage... send me your savegame files [;)]

In all PBEM games I save every turn as I receive it, and a 2nd time as I send it. If TaggedYa do the same it should be really easy to trace the effects on the logistics system.

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: Turner

In all PBEM games I save every turn as I receive it, and a 2nd time as I send it. If TaggedYa do the same it should be really easy to trace the effects on the logistics system.

I got the save files from TaggedYa.
Currently I load all files into the editor, extracting all relevant data.
I'll send it to you, if I'm done with it.

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: rob89

So, I see the data but I have a doubt too : the number under column penetration, that for 'Assembly', 'Engines' & 'Parts' has different values (btw 5 and 90).
What's the meaning and use ? Is it related to the R&D function ?
(i.e. : the R&D function is not simply linear : 100*number of months in advance)

In my experience this value is important for factory capacity increasement.
So to speak this value in column penetration determines the chance when factories could increase their capacity.
(but I could be totally wrong [;)] )

Any others here who knows a bit more about this?

[Turner]

Guys, one of the most annoying aspects of the DB editor is changing 'pool' values, how many a/c is present in the pool when starting the game. I've found when loading the '43 BtR' capaign most values in this column does not show but switching to the 'device' tab then back to 'aircraft' will update it.

For testing the new aircraft types I'm adding them to the a/c pool, obviously to avoid having to play through the whole campaign. Changes to this 'pool' value does not always save, for some reason, and it is especially difficult when zeroing the pooled aircraft. The new zero values simply doesn't save! Could someone look into this issue to see if it can be fixed?

Thanks.


Edit: Ok I've found a workaround. Instead of entering the value zero into the cell, delete the data so that the cell is empty. Then scroll with the arrow keys over the deleted cells and the value should update to zero. Then save, you may have to save after each deleted cell. This works for me. To verify the cell has been zeroed switch to the 'device' tab then back to 'aircraft' and if the value is still zero it should be ok. You will still need to verify by loading the campaign file in the game and check the pool values.

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: Turner


Edit: Ok I've found a workaround. Instead of entering the value zero into the cell, delete the data so that the cell is empty. Then scroll with the arrow keys over the deleted cells and the value should update to zero. Then save, you may have to save after each deleted cell. This works for me. To verify the cell has been zeroed switch to the 'device' tab then back to 'aircraft' and if the value is still zero it should be ok. You will still need to verify by loading the campaign file in the game and check the pool values.

Turner, I'm pretty sure, the values in the aircraft editor regarding the pool values only have the meaning
of a interest value.
Because the aircraft editor wouldn't know, if you want to change the default campaign (i.e Campaign 43,)
or if you would change the Nachtjagd I, Avalanche or Introductinory scenario)

So, I would suggest to change the pool values in the device tab instead of the aircraft tab value.

Thanks for your effort!!
Creeper

[Turner]

???

Which column in the device tab would change the number of a/c in the pool???

[warshipbuilder]

Here is the final version of the RCAF OOB for BoB41.

If somebody would implement these changes in the editor and then u/l it to the forum it would be appreciated.

Better still, if somebody could walk me through on how to make the changes I will gladly do it myself. Give a man a fish you can feed him for a day, teach him how to fish.........

Off to 1943!

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: Turner

???

Which column in the device tab would change the number of a/c in the pool???

Sorry for the confusion; I meant the scenario tab, of course!

[Turner]

Ok!

[rob89]

Some questions for the database experts :

a) why german AA Radars (FuG 202, 212, 218, 220, 240) have 'effect' = 0, while british AI Mk IV, VII and X have 1000, 2000 and 3000 (but Mk VIII = 0) ? What's the meaning (and the impact) of this parameter and the ratio of those values ?

b) why the 128mm Flak is not produced during the game ? Only 148 guns, from the scenario start, without day by day production (historically, 600+ produced in 1944 alone). Is there a parameter - somewhere in the database - ruling the issue ?

c) why Ta 152C has a fuel consumption = 4, while Ta 152H, Fw 190D, etc = 2 and all german 2E = 2 or 3 ? Error ?

d) Does the combat engine have some parameter ruling the ammo consumption, during the fight ?

e) what's the meaning of 'default' in the 'doctrine' ?


thank you in advance

Rob

[Creeper]

ORIGINAL: rob89

Some questions for the database experts :

I'm not an expert, but...

a) why german AA Radars (FuG 202, 212, 218, 220, 240) have 'effect' = 0, while british AI Mk IV, VII and X have 1000, 2000 and 3000 (but Mk VIII = 0) ? What's the meaning (and the impact) of this parameter and the ratio of those values ?

Where do you see an effect = 0?
In the editor all german aircraft radar has an effect parameter.
Only radar receiver doesn't need an effect.
What's the meaning? I don't know...


b) why the 128mm Flak is not produced during the game ? Only 148 guns, from the scenario start, without day by day production (historically, 600+ produced in 1944 alone). Is there a parameter - somewhere in the database - ruling the issue ?

That is WAD.
Somewhere in the manual is written that there is no production of the 128mm flak.
Also there is no parameter ruling this issue..it's hardcoded that there is no production.



c) why Ta 152C has a fuel consumption = 4, while Ta 152H, Fw 190D, etc = 2 and all german 2E = 2 or 3 ? Error ?

d) Does the combat engine have some parameter ruling the ammo consumption, during the fight ?

no, the combat engine only uses the fuel, respectively the endurance parameter of the planes.
(except AA rockets)


e) what's the meaning of 'default' in the 'doctrine' ?


thank you in advance

Rob

[rob89]

ORIGINAL: Creeper

a) why german AA Radars (FuG 202, 212, 218, 220, 240) have 'effect' = 0, while british AI Mk IV, VII and X have 1000, 2000 and 3000 (but Mk VIII = 0) ? What's the meaning (and the impact) of this parameter and the ratio of those values ?

Where do you see an effect = 0?
In the editor all german aircraft radar has an effect parameter.
Only radar receiver doesn't need an effect.
What's the meaning? I don't know...

You can see the values in this picture, from the editor.

German AA radars seem to have 'effect' = 0, while british radars have 1000, or 2000, 3000 ...

regards

[Creeper]

That is interesting, rob.

I'm using a different device database (the one from Turner),
where all german aircraft radar devices have an effect value.

[Turner]

Yes... but only because I edited the data... it's experimental and very uncertain what effect it will really have. So far in my game it does not seem to have any effect at all, but I guess one would need to track all data and compare statistically to see any detectable pattern.

[Turner]

By the way, I think one of the major flaws in the game is that it makes no difference between various .50 BMG installations. I'll be the first one to admit I'm no expert on allied fighters, but as I understand it the standard .50 BMG setup on the P51 and P47 was that each pair of BMG had their convergence at staggered distances. I don't know the exact distances, but say the outer pair on the P51D was set at 450 yds, the middle pair at 400 yds and the inner pair at 350 yds, this would give a good coverage in terms of volume. The purpose was to make the average pilot a better shot, the drawback being that good pilots (with good aim) would be less accurate. Since there were more average pilots than good pilots the intention was to get better overall results in combat.

For the .50 BMG mounted in a bomber defensive position, there is a huge difference in accuracy between a manually held and operated gun, and a turret installed gun. The turret would typically have a much greater effective range usually in a twin configuration.

So as you look into this you can easily see that the single type of .50 BMG in the game grossly simplify the situation, and imho the performance can and probably should be slightly better for both the allied fighters using the .50 BMG and the bombers with turret operated guns.

Any thoughts on this? Do anyone have the correct data for the P51 convergence setup???

Thanks