Game Engines: Good Beginner Suggestion?

[Anthropoid]

Posted this over at Norbsoft, but I reckon I might get some responses here too.

I want to try to put some of my ideas about turn-based strategy game into practice. I've been looking around at freeware game development engines and I'm honestly stunned by how many different choices there are. I'm sure that every engine has its pros and cons, but I'm not really even sure which ones are good possibilities for my purposes.

Out of that lists the ones that seem like they might fit with my needs are:
Angel2D
ClanLib (SDK seems useful)
Polycode (wow that sounds pretty amazing really)

2D Turn-based strategy is definitely what I have in mind.

Two other possibilities that I've downloaded are C-Evo and TripleA.

My goal at this point is to just 'get my feet wet' and hopefully come up with something that is functional, even if it is not suitable to expand on. Mainly a learning experience that might lead to something that players could actually use.

The games that inspire me the most are:
Civ 3
Crown of Glory / Forge of Freedom series
Distant Worlds
East India Company

Any suggestions on which engine(s) I might look a bit more into?

[Missouri_Rebel]

It seems like you enjoy a nation/force building games that encompasses a tactical aspect too.

Suggestions? Sorry.

[wodin]

Unity is the one at the moment I think. Sure you can get some sort of free version.

[Anthropoid]

ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

It seems like you enjoy a nation/force building games that encompasses a tactical aspect too.

Suggestions? Sorry.

Yes, I think that is exactly right. Ultimately, I would like to develop a game that is what I think Civ V "should have been" but with key elements from the more operationally and tactically detailed games like WCS' work. I'm sure the aspirations in my head far, far outstrip my current ability; and who knows maybe I'll never get very far. But everybody has to start at the beginning.

ORIGINAL: wodin

Unity is the one at the moment I think. Sure you can get some sort of free version.

Unity Engine

Holy crap that sounds perfect Wodin. THANKS!

[decaro]

If you're going turn-based, WEGO is the way to go.

[Anthropoid]

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

If you're going turn-based, WEGO is the way to go.

Not finding anything on that one Joe. Only thing that comes up is EGO Engine.

[Hertston]

It's not an engine; WEGO (we-go) refers to designs where player turns are simultaneous in contrast to alternating (I-GO-UGO). I'd disagree with Joe in that I think both have their place depending on game scale and other aspects of the design. It's also quite possible to have a phase system that involves elements of both in the same game.

Looking at that list a lot might depend on which base language you are happier with. If you are starting from scratch I'd suggest Java.

[VPaulus]

Unity is a good choice.... from what I hear very versatile and easy to port to other platforms.
Also it seems to have good support and a growing community.

[Anthropoid]

ORIGINAL: VPaulus

Unity is a good choice.... from what I hear very versatile and easy to port to other platforms.
Also it seems to have good support and a growing community.

Yeah, that is what I noticed too. I was not sure how well suited it is for turn-based games, nor for games with fairly rudimentary 2d graphics.

However, I would think if it can do high end graphics it should be able to do lower-end graphics.

The only programming language I have any facility with is SAS, which is a database and business intelligence application, and I wouldn't even say I'm beyond 'proficiency' with that. So any underlying language is likely to be about an equal challenge for me and I don't think that is an appropriate thing to decide which engine to fiddle with.

I don't foresee having ANYTHING to share with anyone for at least 6 months if not a year, and like I say, maybe it'll fizzle. But I have been thinking about my 'dream game' for so many years, and now find myself at a career change moment . . . it only makes sense to get this on the stove so to speak, even if it is 'on the back burner.'

Unity sounds good in that:
1. There is a free version that is sufficient to complete a working prototype or alpha version, and I could even sell it for a bit (up to $100,000 per annum I read) without having to buy the pro version. I can tell you, if I made a mere $2000 bucks on game designing I'd drop that $1,500 to own a licensed version of the Unity-pro version, and "quit my day job" in a heartbeat! [:D] Not hard to do when you are currently "between" day jobs!

2. The engine seems to have been built with accessibility to beginning game developers in mind, and it sounds like there is a supportive community for beginners. That is a huge plus.

3. It has "Integrated Development Environment," which I don't know exactly what that means in practical terms, but I'm guessing that its like a bitchin' Camaro, which is always good stuff! [:'(]

The two questions I don't yet know about Unity are:

4. Are there canned AI's available? can these be tweaked by a beginning developer to suit a specific game?

5. How is the game at data-intensive backend processes? I'd like to make my game elements (citizens, terrain pieces, military units, cities, etc) as rich as feasible in terms of their quantitative attributes.

[Kineas]

Pick the programming language first. I suggest Java or C#.

I'm not sure you need an 'engine' for a basic 2D game. Unity is designed for 3D action games, you can build Civ-like games with it but it's not that straightforward.

I suggest writing very small games first. The game you envision takes thousands of hours for pros.

Implementing a WEGO game is harder than an IGOUGO. I think the easiest would be a 'pausable realtime' simulation, like Distant Worlds.

[milkweg]

I suggest learning assembler, closest to the metal and if you learn that all other languages will be child's play.

[wodin]

Flashpoint Campaigns has a great WEGO mechanic..ask them what they use.

[Lützow]

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

The only programming language I have any facility with is SAS, which is a database and business intelligence application, and I wouldn't even say I'm beyond 'proficiency' with that. So any underlying language is likely to be about an equal challenge for me and I don't think that is an appropriate thing to decide which engine to fiddle with.

I'd propose to start with something more easy, like a browser game in JavaScript. There are plenty of tutorials available on the web. Learning to code is like learning to drive a car. Traffic rules are the same, regardless of your vehicle, but there is a reason that people usually prefer a small car over a truck.

Same goes for programming. Long ago I looked into C++, thinking that if one can handle the mother-of-all, everything else should be a cakewalk. Unfortunately, C++ turned out as the truck. Cumbersome, complicated and it takes quite some learning-time before you can do anything useful with it. I lost my enthusiasm fast.

In my second attempt - four years ago - I chose the small car. Learned HTML, PHP, Ruby, JavaScript and the according frameworks mostly by self-studies. This time I succeeded and could shift my career. My current interest goes toward app development and the following step would be to fiddle with the Unity engine. However, on this path I got a solid understanding of programming and a job as web developer already.

tl;dr if you're not planning to drop your current life for gaining a degree in computer science, rather start with small steps and avoid Java or C++/C#.

[Anthropoid]

Ah thanks for all the feedback guys!

[RedArgo]

Unity 3d uses C# or Unity Script, which I think is their version of Java Script, for its scripting language. I use C# since that's what I use at work mostly. I believe they are coming out with, or may already have, a version geared more towards 2d. I've gone through some tutorials and there is a lot in there that it can do and it is pretty easy to get some basic stuff up and running. As soon as I have some free time, I'm going to go deeper and see what I can do.

Keep us updated on which path you choose, I'm always interested in hearing about other people's game making experiences.

Bill

[Anthropoid]

I've downloaded and installed Unity Free. Lots to learn! I'll post in here periodically as I make progress.