Pricing Suggestion

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: JRyan

ORIGINAL: juancho

Hell $80 is a bargain for the amount of time I will end up playing this game.

And that is one of the very reasons that should be considered when purchasing the sim.

I wasn't happy about the price of WiTE. And said so. But I bought it anyway, and am happy I did.

Haven't complained about prices since.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Blighty56

Lol yep but she's no jewellery fan[:(]

Jewelry worked for mine. Throwing money at her worked too

So the game cost you a LOT more than $80 [:)]

Yeah. She loves jewelry. Could be worse, she wanted a Porsche. Settled for a BMW.

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Alchenar

In the twenty pages of this thread I have not seen Aurelian make a single post that wasn't a one or two line thin ad-hominem or a demand that people 'go away'.
his lazy and bad-faith challenges

Adhom much? Hypocrite, haven't seen a single post where I said go away. Or any that cross a line.



But many, in 20 pages, where the same crowd thinks that they know better than the company that develops and sells these game games. Oh the arrogance of those.

Haven't seen an post in 20 pages that shows any verifiable evidence that they know better either.

Instead of being a lazy lad and listing a list of games as if this ill thought way to avoid making a well thought out post, why not add something new instead of whining about me.

I assume your response to my analysis will be forthcoming now that you've gotten the short and quick responses out of the way? I mean, not to toot my own horn here, but I think the points I've made there ARE somewhat compelling and would require a fairly-well thought-out response, but if you think they can be easily and quickly dismissed, I would like to hear why you think so.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Alchenar

In the twenty pages of this thread I have not seen Aurelian make a single post that wasn't a one or two line thin ad-hominem or a demand that people 'go away'.
his lazy and bad-faith challenges

Adhom much? Hypocrite, haven't seen a single post where I said go away. Or any that cross a line.



But many, in 20 pages, where the same crowd thinks that they know better than the company that develops and sells these game games. Oh the arrogance of those.

Haven't seen an post in 20 pages that shows any verifiable evidence that they know better either.

Instead of being a lazy lad and listing a list of games as if this ill thought way to avoid making a well thought out post, why not add something new instead of whining about me.

I assume your response to my analysis will be forthcoming now that you've gotten the short and quick responses out of the way? I mean, not to toot my own horn here, but I think the points I've made there ARE somewhat compelling and would require a fairly-well thought-out response, but if you think they can be easily and quickly dismissed, I would like to hear why you think so.

Your name is Alchenar? One should not assume.

Instead of troubling myself to make some long winded response, and having very bad hands precludes it, I'll just cut to the chase.

You have market research to prove them wrong?

You have evidence that they are losing money with the price as is?

If you do, provide it.

If not, then there is nothing new.

Ask yourself, why have the developers dropped out of this thread?

No wordy response needed.

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Your name is Alchenar? One should not assume.

I was, uh, talking about my post just now. You know, the multi-page monstrosity that uses Matrix Game's own released sales data about iOS sales to demonstrate how lower prices and the use of major distributors have resulted in astonishingly good sales figures, and how the same strategy that worked on the App Store has every reason to succeed on Steam. I figured that it'd take you some time to work up a full response - I have to admit I'd be a touch offended otherwise, given the time and effort I put into it - so I was asking if you're currently writing that up now that you got the shorter, less effort-intensive responses to others out of the way first.

[Alchenar]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

Adhom much? Hypocrite, haven't seen a single post where I said go away. Or any that cross a line.



But many, in 20 pages, where the same crowd thinks that they know better than the company that develops and sells these game games. Oh the arrogance of those.

Haven't seen an post in 20 pages that shows any verifiable evidence that they know better either.

Instead of being a lazy lad and listing a list of games in this ill thought way to avoid making a well thought out post, why not add something new instead of whining about me.

Well I wrote some things earlier, but given that tomn is making my case right now with considerable effort I'm happy not to step on his toes as he does it.

I am however enjoying seeing you live up to the appropriateness of the title 'Matrix Elite Guard'


e: to provide a tangible contribution to the thread here, I'll point out that people have been confusing having to have a debate with winning a debate.

Nobody is suggesting that Matrix have to have this debate. But if people from Matrix choose to engage in it then exercising their right to walk away doesn't actually have any relation to the merits of the various arguments. It just means that in practice whoever wins the argument doesn't have any consequences towards how Matrix choose to run their business. But then we all knew that going in.

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Instead of troubling myself to make some long winded response, and having very bad hands precludes it, I'll just cut to the chase.

You have market research to prove them wrong?

You have evidence that they are losing money with the price as is?

If you do, provide it.

If not, then there is nothing new.

Ask yourself, why have the developers dropped out of this thread?

No wordy response needed.

...um.

Yes. Yes I did. I used Matrix's own sales figures and their own data which they provided to make the point.

And...uh...are you aware that my point (and those of most others) is not that Matrix is losing money, but rather they are earning far less than they should rightfully be earning by sticking to obsolete distribution and pricing strategies?

Did you...did you actually read anything I wrote? Did you read anything I ever wrote? Why exactly are you complaining about there being the same arguments over and over again if you don't even know what the arguments are or bother to look them over?

Edit: By all means, step on my toes. If you happen to bring up a point I forgot to mention or didn't think of, that's all to the good.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Your name is Alchenar? One should not assume.

I was, uh, talking about my post just now. You know, the multi-page monstrosity that uses Matrix Game's own released sales data about iOS sales to demonstrate how lower prices and the use of major distributors have resulted in astonishingly good sales figures, and how the same strategy that worked on the App Store has every reason to succeed on Steam. I figured that it'd take you some time to work up a full response - I have to admit I'd be a touch offended otherwise, given the time and effort I put into it - so I was asking if you're currently writing that up now that you got the shorter, less effort-intensive responses to others out of the way first.

I was, uh, not referring to you when I typed it. I have no control over what you assume.

And no, I'm not given to typing long winded responses to anything. I go right to the bottom line.

The bottom line is that you have *no* data that shows they are wrong.

How Steam or Apps stores operate is not relevant. Steam, for example, does not *develop* games. They distribute them.

I'd address the "touched offended otherwise" line after the hand stops hurting.

[Xornox]

ORIGINAL: jalefkowit

The result is kind of hilarious. Look at the Matrix online store and you see some real head-spinners. Steel Panthers World at War: Generals Edition, a title that is coming up on fourteen years old and doesn't even work properly in modern versions of Windows (!), is on offer for US$70 --

Exactly! Especially selling Steel Panthers for 70$ is a crime. I almost went to that scheme but luckily tested it before purchasing. Of course, it was impossible get to work in my computer.

I have similar Matrix game list as in the message above, but I am now starting to lose my respect to this company. I am done...

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Instead of troubling myself to make some long winded response, and having very bad hands precludes it, I'll just cut to the chase.

You have market research to prove them wrong?

You have evidence that they are losing money with the price as is?

If you do, provide it.

If not, then there is nothing new.

Ask yourself, why have the developers dropped out of this thread?

No wordy response needed.

...um.

Yes. Yes I did. I used Matrix's own sales figures and their own data which they provided to make the point.

And...uh...are you aware that my point (and those of most others) is not that Matrix is losing money, but rather they are earning far less than they should rightfully be earning by sticking to obsolete distribution and pricing strategies?

Did you...did you actually read anything I wrote? Did you read anything I ever wrote? Why exactly are you complaining about there being the same arguments over and over again if you don't even know what the arguments are or bother to look them over?

Edit: By all means, step on my toes. If you happen to bring up a point I forgot to mention or didn't think of, that's all to the good.

I want *your* figures. Not theirs. Especially as they have not, and have no obligation to, release them all.

You don't *know* that they are losing sales. I'm not interested in speculation. I want the proof.

You don't *know* that they're losing money because it's an $80 download. I don't want speculation. I want the proof.

You don't *know* what their profit margin is. I don't want the speculation. I want the proof.

Who should I believe? The people who have been in this business. And are *still* in business, despite the higher price games? Or the people who say that, despite their success, they're wrong?

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Your name is Alchenar? One should not assume.

I was, uh, talking about my post just now. You know, the multi-page monstrosity that uses Matrix Game's own released sales data about iOS sales to demonstrate how lower prices and the use of major distributors have resulted in astonishingly good sales figures, and how the same strategy that worked on the App Store has every reason to succeed on Steam. I figured that it'd take you some time to work up a full response - I have to admit I'd be a touch offended otherwise, given the time and effort I put into it - so I was asking if you're currently writing that up now that you got the shorter, less effort-intensive responses to others out of the way first.

I was, uh, not referring to you when I typed it. I have no control over what you assume.

And no, I'm not given to typing long winded responses to anything. I go right to the bottom line.

The bottom line is that you have *no* data that shows they are wrong.

How Steam or Apps stores operate is not relevant. Steam, for example, does not *develop* games. They distribute them.

I'd address the "touched offended otherwise" line after the hand stops hurting.

Dude.

Matrix Games sold their games on the App Store.

They did much, much better than their PC sales - better than they expected.

I tried to analyze why.

Not only do I have data, I have Matrix's own freakin' data about their own freakin' games and their own freakin' sales.

Would you mind actually reading that stuff over before you decide that it's completely valueless?

[Alchenar]

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Tomn




I was, uh, talking about my post just now. You know, the multi-page monstrosity that uses Matrix Game's own released sales data about iOS sales to demonstrate how lower prices and the use of major distributors have resulted in astonishingly good sales figures, and how the same strategy that worked on the App Store has every reason to succeed on Steam. I figured that it'd take you some time to work up a full response - I have to admit I'd be a touch offended otherwise, given the time and effort I put into it - so I was asking if you're currently writing that up now that you got the shorter, less effort-intensive responses to others out of the way first.

I was, uh, not referring to you when I typed it. I have no control over what you assume.

And no, I'm not given to typing long winded responses to anything. I go right to the bottom line.

The bottom line is that you have *no* data that shows they are wrong.

How Steam or Apps stores operate is not relevant. Steam, for example, does not *develop* games. They distribute them.

I'd address the "touched offended otherwise" line after the hand stops hurting.

Dude.

Matrix Games sold their games on the App Store.

They did much, much better than their PC sales - better than they expected.

I tried to analyze why.

Not only do I have data, I have Matrix's own freakin' data about their own freakin' games and their own freakin' sales.

Would you mind actually reading that stuff over before you decide that it's completely valueless?

It's okay Tomn. Honour has been satisfied. You get to declare victory and walk off into the sunset now.

[Rob322]

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Instead of troubling myself to make some long winded response, and having very bad hands precludes it, I'll just cut to the chase.

You have market research to prove them wrong?

You have evidence that they are losing money with the price as is?

If you do, provide it.

If not, then there is nothing new.

Ask yourself, why have the developers dropped out of this thread?

No wordy response needed.

...um.

Yes. Yes I did. I used Matrix's own sales figures and their own data which they provided to make the point.

And...uh...are you aware that my point (and those of most others) is not that Matrix is losing money, but rather they are earning far less than they should rightfully be earning by sticking to obsolete distribution and pricing strategies?

Did you...did you actually read anything I wrote? Did you read anything I ever wrote? Why exactly are you complaining about there being the same arguments over and over again if you don't even know what the arguments are or bother to look them over?

Can I ask for a moment whether it really matters if you convince anyone or not? Internet chat boards are usually a bad place to convince people to change their minds and agree with you. And why should they be? No one knows anything about the person they're arguing with. Even if credentials are stated, there's no clear reason why they should automatically be accepted. That's why these things typically devolve into nonsensical rants or name calling and people arguing past one another. Anyhow, who cares if Aurelian read what you wrote; isn't your argument with Matrix? It shouldn't be with the other players but with them. If Matrix is uninterested in discussing this with you then you're stuck. Or you're doomed to this thread, continually arguing with other players in an ever deepening spiral of bickering until eventually the thread is locked. It's your choice of course, I'm not telling you to stop or how to use your time but the folks still fighting the fight (whichever side) are just banging their heads against the wall right now.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Tomn




I was, uh, talking about my post just now. You know, the multi-page monstrosity that uses Matrix Game's own released sales data about iOS sales to demonstrate how lower prices and the use of major distributors have resulted in astonishingly good sales figures, and how the same strategy that worked on the App Store has every reason to succeed on Steam. I figured that it'd take you some time to work up a full response - I have to admit I'd be a touch offended otherwise, given the time and effort I put into it - so I was asking if you're currently writing that up now that you got the shorter, less effort-intensive responses to others out of the way first.

I was, uh, not referring to you when I typed it. I have no control over what you assume.

And no, I'm not given to typing long winded responses to anything. I go right to the bottom line.

The bottom line is that you have *no* data that shows they are wrong.

How Steam or Apps stores operate is not relevant. Steam, for example, does not *develop* games. They distribute them.

I'd address the "touched offended otherwise" line after the hand stops hurting.

Dude.

Matrix Games sold their games on the App Store.

They did much, much better than their PC sales - better than they expected.

I tried to analyze why.

Dude, when I can get WiTE or WiTP-AE to play on my smart phone from the app store, let me know.

Dude, if this app store is so successful, why isn't this game that have people up in arms over a price that they don't want to pay, on it?

Dude, is Civil War II available at an app store.

Dude, this whole round and round the mulberry bush thread is because there are a few that can't afford to buy it.

That is the crux of the matter dude.

[smudge56]

BMW for the game wow... [;)]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

ORIGINAL: Aurelian




Jewelry worked for mine. Throwing money at her worked too

So the game cost you a LOT more than $80 [:)]

Yeah. She loves jewelry. Could be worse, she wanted a Porsche. Settled for a BMW.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Rob322

ORIGINAL: Tomn

ORIGINAL: Aurelian
Instead of troubling myself to make some long winded response, and having very bad hands precludes it, I'll just cut to the chase.

You have market research to prove them wrong?

You have evidence that they are losing money with the price as is?

If you do, provide it.

If not, then there is nothing new.

Ask yourself, why have the developers dropped out of this thread?

No wordy response needed.

...um.

Yes. Yes I did. I used Matrix's own sales figures and their own data which they provided to make the point.

And...uh...are you aware that my point (and those of most others) is not that Matrix is losing money, but rather they are earning far less than they should rightfully be earning by sticking to obsolete distribution and pricing strategies?

Did you...did you actually read anything I wrote? Did you read anything I ever wrote? Why exactly are you complaining about there being the same arguments over and over again if you don't even know what the arguments are or bother to look them over?

Can I ask for a moment whether it really matters if you convince anyone or not? Internet chat boards are usually a bad place to convince people to change their minds and agree with you. And why should they be? No one knows anything about the person they're arguing with. Even if credentials are stated, there's no clear reason why they should automatically be accepted. That's why these things typically devolve into nonsensical rants or name calling and people arguing past one another. Anyhow, who cares if Aurelian read what you wrote; isn't your argument with Matrix? It shouldn't be with the other players but with them. If Matrix is uninterested in discussing this with you then you're stuck. Or you're doomed to this thread, continually arguing with other players in an ever deepening spiral of bickering until eventually the thread is locked. It's your choice of course, I'm not telling you to stop or how to use your time but the folks still fighting the fight (whichever side) are just banging their heads against the wall right now.

Very true.

Bottom line is: The game is priced at what is. I'm not the one who has to be convinced. The ones who have to be convinced are the ones who did all the work and research and published it at the price it is at.

And that isn't going to happen.

Personally, in some ways I wish it was true. Would just love a new Porsche. But I really doubt if I go to their website and told them they're losing sales because of its price, that they would listen.

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: Rob322

Can I ask for a moment whether it really matters if you convince anyone or not? Internet chat boards are usually a bad place to convince people to change their minds and agree with you. And why should they be? No one knows anything about the person they're arguing with. Even if credentials are stated, there's no clear reason why they should automatically be accepted. That's why these things typically devolve into nonsensical rants or name calling and people arguing past one another. Anyhow, who cares if Aurelian read what you wrote; isn't your argument with Matrix? It shouldn't be with the other players but with them. If Matrix is uninterested in discussing this with you then you're stuck. Or you're doomed to this thread, continually arguing with other players in an ever deepening spiral of bickering until eventually the thread is locked. It's your choice of course, I'm not telling you to stop or how to use your time but the folks still fighting the fight (whichever side) are just banging their heads against the wall right now.

Well, as it happens, I like debate. It's something of a hobby of mine. I like trading points, analyzing rebuttals, coming up with counter-arguments and wording it all with the best rhetoric I can come up with. It's fun, and it's interesting in and of itself - the more so when it's for a cause that does seem worthwhile. Call it verbal wargaming, y'know? And I do like to try and keep things on the level when I do so, and I do think that good debate can produce worthwhile discussions and change some key minds (my own being no exception, mark!) It might be a bit odd, and I might spend a bit too much time doing it, but I don't think anyone here is in any real position to throw the first stone when it comes to spending too much effort on their hobbies, eh?

That said, Aurelian is proving himself thoroughly unsatisfying as a debating partner, so yeah, I suppose I should back off him now. I don't suppose you'd have anything to share, though? You seem like a reasonable guy.

[Aurelian]

ORIGINAL: Blighty56

BMW for the game wow... [;)]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

ORIGINAL: Numdydar




So the game cost you a LOT more than $80 [:)]

Yeah. She loves jewelry. Could be worse, she wanted a Porsche. Settled for a BMW.

Well, not this game, but something else I wanted

[smudge56]

Its my personality [;)]

ORIGINAL: gexmex

ORIGINAL: Blighty56

Lol yep but she's no jewellery fan[:(]

ORIGINAL: Aurelian




Jewelry always, or almost always, works.

No Jewelry? No handbags? How do you appease her????????????????????????? haha

[dutchman55555]

ORIGINAL: JDM

BTW, as you are so new to the forum, which of our games do you actually play/own. I am sure posters would be interested.

It's sad that you would demand new participants display their credentials, but if you must, since I am under 100 posts:

Battle of Britain II - Wings of Victory
Decisive Campaigns: The Blitzkrieg from Warsaw to Paris
Forge of Freedom: The American Civil War 1861-1865 3
John Tiller's Battleground Civil War
John Tiller's Battleground Napoleonic Wars
John Tiller's Campaign Series
Larry Bond's Harpoon - Ultimate Edition
Panzer Command: Ostfront
Panzer Corps
Time of Fury
Unity of Command
War in the Pacific - Admiral's Edition

My first computer wargame was AH's Midway. My first computer was a TRS 80 Model I with the (oooooooo!) 16K upgrade which loaded programs from cassette. I personally shook Larry Bond's hand in 1988.

Oh, there are several Matrix purchases missing from there, including the original HttR.

I should also note that my Steam collection numbers 483. This includes a copy of UoC. Yes, I bought it here, then I bought it at Steam as well, as it was cheaper to buy the DLC with the original on Steam than it was to buy the DLC alone here. Food for thought.

Oh, I also have several AGEOD titles, but haven't bought any since Matrix gobbled them up, and at their current price point I won't be buying any more in the near future.