Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

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Seminole
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Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

I've played through one '41 GC as the Soviets against the AI (won in Q3 of '43) and started a server game with an acquaintance from another forum. That game is still underway in early Feb '42.

This PBEM (random weather, full FOW) represents my third go at the '41 Soviet GC. I'll be running this AAR at least 10 turns behind the game, so my opponent is welcome to peruse its contents.

I'll post full theater images (1,500px × 2,464px, click for full size) with higher zoom pictures as circumstances dictate.

Without further ado, turn 1:

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Turn 1
6/22/41

Lvov is captured, but otherwise progress is poor with no pocket to speak of in the south.
13th Panzer is moving through the mountains west of Tarnopol instead of the plains.
11th and 14th Panzer are located northeast of Tarnopol.

10th Motorized is cut off on the SW edge of the Pripyat marshes.

Routed units are moved into the Stalin Line and reserves are placed to try and stage a fighting withdrawal to the Dnepr.

The Gross Deutschland Motorized Regiment goes on a foray into the midst of the Pripyat. Their supplies are cut by 75th Rifle Division and 18th NKVD regiment is stationed astride the rail link to Brest Litovsk. 56th Rifle Division blocks GD's progress behind the Yaselda river. Hopefully more units can be lured into the swamps to rescue them from their misguided volksmarch.

North of the swamps 3rd and 4th Panzer div. are identified in the vanguard, still 50 miles from Minsk.
19th and 12th Panzer div. are forming the northern pincer attacking Western Front, 50 and 30 miles from Minsk respectively.

Riga is not presently threatened, as German armored and motorized forces are moving line abreast toward the Daugava river at the bend.

Hope is to continue naval evacuation from the Baltic States to Leningrad and establish the Luga river line as soon as possible.

Begin constructing line north of Lake Ladoga to hold wily Finns should they get uppity and try to stab the Motherland in the back.

To the far south we also begin a pull back in case the Rumanians are convinced to sign their own death warrant and attack the Red Army.

Zhukov is put in charge of Stavka automatically. Timoshenko is appointed to the post in his stead.

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"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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vlcz
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by vlcz »

No riga/ crossing daugava? no seize of baltic ports[:-]? no south pocket of any size[X(]? even no union between PzGpe 2 and 3? [:(]... this will be an uncommon game for sure[8|]

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Seminole
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Historically, Riga was not entered until July 1, 1941, there was no Lvov pocket formed in four days, and 2nd and 3rd Panzer Armee didn't link up until June 27th (turn 2). His path with 4th Panzer Armee is indeed historical.

Constructive criticism of both sides is encouraged, but please understand neither of us have a dozen starts under our belts and my opponent (like OKH) hasn't practiced multiple starts to determine how best to maneuver around the Red Army's (mostly frozen) units.

Fear not, things will get 'unhistorical' soon enough!
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by wmcalpine »

Seminole,

I think this will be a great game to watch. One that does not follow the standard prescription of turn 1. This will provide some valuable insights I am sure!! Good luck to you both.

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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Ron »

ORIGINAL: Seminole

Historically, Riga was not entered until July 1, 1941, there was no Lvov pocket formed in four days, and 2nd and 3rd Panzer Armee didn't link up until June 27th (turn 2). His path with 4th Panzer Armee is indeed historical.

Constructive criticism of both sides is encouraged, but please understand neither of us have a dozen starts under our belts and my opponent (like OKH) hasn't practiced multiple starts to determine how best to maneuver around the Red Army's (mostly frozen) units.

Fear not, things will get 'unhistorical' soon enough!

That's well and fine re historical. However, your German opponent will soon discover he will have to do MUCH better than historical to even compete on a level playing field. In this example, blowing the initial Russians off of the line instead of encircling and capturing them, will create an insurmountable problem down the road.
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

That's well and fine re historical. However, your German opponent will soon discover he will have to do MUCH better than historical to even compete on a level playing field.

I think that is part of the difficulty in creating a(n enjoyable, competitive) game based on a historical scenario.  Hitler (and OKH) really didn't realize how much they had bitten off, and it turned out to be more than they could chew.
In this example, blowing the initial Russians off of the line instead of encircling and capturing them, will create an insurmountable problem down the road

That was certainly my hope.  I intend to manage a fighting withdrawal in '41.  Forcing him to fight for all defensible terrain, and pay as high an MP price as possible for his advance.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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Seminole
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 2
6/26/1941

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4th Panzer Armee has bridged the Daugava at two points, while 18th Army continues pushing toward Riga.

Minsk falls and the elements of 2nd and 3rd Panzer Armee consolidate for their next push eastward.

Gross Deutschland backtracks out of the swamps and re-establishes LOC with the main body with the support of three infantry divisions.

In the south Tarnopol, Stanislav and Chernovtsy are still defended. We're trying to hold open the escape route for the Hungarian border guards, but odds are slim.
Further south a general retreat from the border to the hills and rivers from the Rumanian front.

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The northern Ladoga line is established and digging begins in earnest with 7th Independent Army given responsibility for this avenue of approach. With proper application of reserves this chokepoint may hold, but at a minimum we hope to make the Finns pay a price, and keep them away from the eastern Ladoga ports as long as possible (and avoid paying the elevated AP price for fortifying the eastern Finnish no attack line).

The first pickets in the Luga river line begin spreading out from Novogorod.

Pickets are also established on the east bank of the Dnepr behind Mogilev.

Bold action by the Northwest Front succeeds in cutting supply line to several German panzer and motorized formations (1st Pzr Div, 8th Pzr Div, 3rd Mot Div, and 18th Mot Div along with XXXXI Pzr Korps HQ). This can't be good for AGN's timetables!

In the Pripyat a gauntlet of forces take up positions in the swamps, daring Gross Deutschland to repeat their adventure.

Southwest Front establishes successive defensive lines at the rivers and any suitable copse of trees while further east the entrenchments around Kiev and Cherkassy are begun in preparation for the inevitable Nazi assault.

Southern Front continues to utilize the terrain features, and compels the Germans and their Rumanian lackeys to repeatedly deploy for combat instead of drive eastward unopposed. Kirovograd, Krivoi Rog, and Nikolaev remain garrisoned to begin establishing the anchors for the Ingul and Ingulets river lines that Southern Front will fall back toward.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by 2ndACR »

This going to be painful to watch. As a German player only, this is completely unheard of.
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 3
7/3/41

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Riga is still unassaulted and 18th Armee has bypassed the strategic naval facility at Liepāja.
German supplies are restored to XXXXI Panzer Corps and the hungry units of 4th Panzer Armee.
Next turn AGN can resume their move toward Pskov.

AGC is making a heavy infantry commitment to clearing the Pripyat. Stavka welcomes this diversion, and continues to balance the withdrawal of units by rail and keeping the bait dangling in front of Germans eager to wage battle in such unforgiving terrain.

AGS makes contact with the Rumanian border, storms Tarnopol and Chernovtsy and succeeds in trapping irretrievably the security and mountain forces that manned the Hungarian border. Kishinev also falls to remorseless German infantry.

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Evacuees from the Gulf of Riga join emergency recruits raised in Leningrad to complete the Luga river line while Northwest Front continues to fall back as orderly as possible.

The recruits raised in Moscow are sent to screen the advance between Vitebsk and Mogilev, while a few remain behind to begin creating fortifications in the capital itself.

Southwest Front continues its own orderly withdrawal, establishing new fall back lines.

Southern Front's northern flank pulls back to the Dnestr river and hills to regroup and again slow the Rumanians advance.

By this point most major Russian cities have at least one rifle division in garrison beginning to dig in.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 4
7/10/41

Rains in the central Soviet zone force most German armies to simply consolidate their gains.

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Riga is assaulted by 5 Inf Div (with 11 accompanying support units), numbering almost 90k men with over 1k gun tubes and they easily force retreat by the 22nd NKVD Rifle Div.
A follow up attack across the Gauja river and into the swamps to the northeast of Riga by the 291st Inf Div is stopped by the 10th NKVD border regiment with less than 50 losses on both sides.   

Finns attack along the northern flank, unwilling to move in the mud to the south.   7th Ind Army orders a quick fall back to the North Ladoga Line and sets up a screen of NKVD security detachments to provide as much time as possible for digging in.  Hope is to use the chokepoint and rivers to hold the Finnish advance as long as possible. 
The untenable position of 8th Rifle Bde is vacated at Hanko and they are shipped to Tallinn.  The fortifications are dismantled before being abandoned.

The Red Army hold in 3 of 4 attacks on the western edge of the Pripyat in the rain.  More than 10 Inf Div are committed to the Pripyat sweep.  Withdrawal continues slowly to entice Germans deeper into the muck.

Rovno is still held because of the rain.  Proskurov is skirted to the south by XIV Panzer Korps, flanking the hilltop position holding back the Rumanians.

Proskurov closeup at beginning of turn:

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9th Army moves reserves into the region between the Dnestr and Yuzhny Bug rivers to try and screen a deep flanking movement on the Dnestr line.

The garrison at Liepāja are ordered to abandon their positions and seek to form partisan cells among the loyal Russian and Soviet citizens of the region.  The Latvians wait in vain for their Nazi 'liberators' to secure the city.

Image
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 5
7/17/41

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The Finns push toward the North Ladoga Line, but security detachments succeed in delaying them from reaching the river.

Germans on the move again.  AGN forms a pocket formed at Lake Lubanas.

The Wehrmacht tears through Vitebsk with the 17th & 20th Pzr Div and heads north of the Dvina.  AGC also makes contact on the outskirts of Mogilev and pushes armored/motorized formations into the land bridge toward Smolensk (18th Pzr Div in the vanguard).

152th Rifle Div holds Rovno against 299th Inf Div, but in Proskurov the 240th Mot Div retreats under pressure from three German Inf Div.

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On the North Ladoga Line security detachments fresh from the trains take up positions between the Finns and the North Ladoga Line.

The pocket at Lake Lubanas is broken.

Continue forming line along the Dnepr south of Cherkassy as SW Front continues to screen against AGS.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by wadortch »

Has your opponent played much? He is in real trouble and should know that.
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by 2ndACR »

he is in big trouble. Tell him to start an AAR so he can get some help/advice from the forum. Otherwise he could get discouraged and not PBEM anymore.
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Has your opponent played much? He is in real trouble and should know that

I'm his first human opponent.
As stated above, I've played through one '41 GC as the Soviets against the AI (won in Q3 of '43) and started a server game with an acquaintance from another forum. That game is still underway in early Feb '42.
Constructive criticism encouraged, for both sides.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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Seminole
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

he is in big trouble. Tell him to start an AAR so he can get some help/advice from the forum. Otherwise he could get discouraged and not PBEM anymore.

We just hit turn 25 (waiting on the turn from him now).  I've sent him a link to this thread.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 6
7/24/41

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The Finns push back the security detachments and assault the North Ladoga Line.  9 Rifle Div, with 2 Tank Div in reserve, hold this line under 7th Ind. Army.  The Finns try to bridge the river, but are repulsed, suffering almost 2500 men lost compared to under 500 men lost in the Red Army.

1st, 8th Pzr Div with Totenkopf SS and 36th Mot Div move up to Baltic coast north of lake Peipus.

3rd, 14th and Motorized, accompanied by 17th, 19th, 20th Pzr Div push from Vitebsk toward Velikie Luki

Mogilev falls while Smolensk is skirted on the north by armor (4th, 7th, 12th, 17th, 18th Pzr Div, and 29th Mot Div.) moving through the land bridge.

Viking SS motorized division is just across the river south of Zhitomir.

In Vinnitsa 15 Mot Div, 216th Mot Div, and 189th Rifle Div are cut off as 1st Panzer Armee flows east and establishes a cordon on the east side of the city.

18th Army remains trapped in the high ground of the Moldova-Ukraine border, with the line broken into two pockets.

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27th Army, Northwest Front, attempts to screen the Baltic coast of Estonia, while 6th Cavalry Div moves to choke supplies to the AGN spearhead.  A screen is established on the north side of Lake Peipus to slow the panzer/motorized thrust.

3rd Mot Div, west of Velikie Luki, is cut off from German LOC.

More units are pulled from the Pripyat to help fill in the screen in front of Moscow and Bryansk.

The motorized forces in Vinnitsa succeed in breaking out toward the west and re-establishing communications with 13th Tank Division that also cuts off Viking SS south of Zhitomir.

Further south 3rd Cavalry Div is able to link up with the easternmost elements in the Moldavian border pocket. 

With the German 11th Army across the Dnestr river in force Southern Front pulls back to screen the advance ahead of the next line to be established on the Yuzhny Bug river.
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 7
7/31/41

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Finns build up against North Ladoga Line, but don't attack this week.

36th Mot Div reaches outskirts of Tallinn, pushing back elements of 27th Army in the process and cutting off a security detachment.
1st & 8th Pzr Div push through screen to Narva river supported by Totenkopf SS Mot Div

27th Army (NW Front) still screen Estonian Baltic coast.  Main job is diversion, hope to evacuate by sea in one or two weeks.

5th Rifle Div protects the approach through the swamps south of Lake Peipus.

23rd Army (Northern Front) still hold Pskov and Velikaya river line.  Will fall back on the swamps as soon as flanked

12th and 17th Panzer break down and moves through swamps on wide front toward Velikie Luki from the south.

Smolensk is briefly cut off, but the pocket isn't tight.

3rd and 7th Pzr Div cross the Dnepr toward Bryansk.  The Dnepr bend between Mogilev and Smolensk is abandoned accordingly.

Way too many Germans still slogging through the swamps.  Trying to keep bait in front of them, but pull most forces to begin establishing line in front of Bryansk.

9th, 11th and 13th Panzer move north past the west side of Zhitomir.  May be trying to sever rail into Pripyat, but almost all forces are already evacuated by rail.  Pull forces from Rovno area to avoid encirclement.

10th, 16th and unidentified Pzr Div moving SE from Vinnitsa.  Screen established in front of them while reinforcements begin digging line in front of D-Z.

18th Army hopelessly cut off.  Mtn divisions still trekking around by Hungarian border.

1st Rum Armored Div overextends itself and is cut off.  3rd Cav and 44th tank division form screen.  Intend next turn to force Rumanian surrender if panzers don't rush to their aid.

Falling back more rapidly on Odessa.  Intend to try and hold with 25th and 51st Rifle Div and HQ.  May send another rifle division instead of HQ.

Image
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

Turn 8
8/7/41

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Finns hit the north flank of the North Ladoga Line, but are repulsed.

AGN pounds back the screen north of Lake Peipus (1st Pzr Div, 6th Pzr Div, 8th Pzr Div, Totenkopf SS and Polizei SS), but is still 10 miles from the Luga river.

36th Mot Div fails to seize Tallinn against 11th Rifle Div and 8th Rifle Bde, but a follow up attack by 217th and 291st Inf Div succeed in taking the city.

27th Army is forced to retreat to Hiiumaa.  Shipping is gathered to help them escape through the port of Kuressare starting next week.

251st Inf Div eases past Pskov on the northwest.  The Velikaya river is bridged along its length.  Pskov can't be held past next week.

Smolensk falls with horrific casualties.  3rd Pzr Div, 18th Mot Div, 29th Mot Div, Gross Deutschland, 26th Inf Div, 161st Inf Div, 258th Inf Div, and 3/252nd Inf Div assault.  1st Mot Div and 265th Rifle Division defend (18,206 men, 155 art, 168 AFV) losing 10,889 men, 109 art, and 165 AFVs.

AGC turns south and crosses the headwaters of the Oster river.

Image

Southern Front must pull back to the Sinyukha and Yuzhny Bug river lines.

Image
"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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Seminole
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by Seminole »

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"War is never a technical problem only, and if in pursuing technical solutions you neglect the psychological and the political, then the best technical solutions will be worthless." - Hermann Balck
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vlcz
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RE: Man of Steel vs. the Bohemian Corporal

Post by vlcz »

Fresh AAR style, quick descriptive and effective, specially fond of that full front screen that can be expanded. I miss a OOB/total losses combined screen.

As for the game, you are quite active on the forum to know the german advance is a lot less flashy that the standard ones. But there is no better way to learn the trade that doing it, so while you both enjoy the game it is a good one.
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