70th British Infantry Division

[Capt Cliff]

The 70th British Infantry division arrived without any infantry squads. I have the 18th on the map and it has 324 squads. Any reason the squads are missing from this unit, not even listed in the TO&E?

[Capt Cliff]

Here's the TO&E display.

[2ndACR]

I think that was one of the div meant as a cadre. Been a really long time so memory fails.

[awadley]

The Inf Brg were not sent to the far east and are not included in WitPAE.


The 70th Infantry Division was a British Army division during the Second World War.

Contents [hide]
1 History
2 Commanding officers
3 Structure
3.1 14th Infantry Brigade
3.2 16th Infantry Brigade
3.3 23rd Infantry Brigade '
3.4 Support Units
4 See also
5 References
6 External links


[edit] HistoryThis formation had a brief history during the Second World War. It was formed originally in the Middle East from units stationed in Egypt, Palestine, Cyprus and (later) in Crete, as the regular British 6th Infantry Division. It was then redesignated as the 70th Division on 10 October 1941. (The reason for the change of designation is unknown. The new number was a vacant one in the List of British divisions in World War I; however, 6th Armoured Division had been created on 12 September 1941, and 7th Inf Div had previously reported to be redesignated to avoid confusion with 7th Armoured Division.)

The division's only action as a complete formation was during the defense of Tobruk, when it was brought in by sea to relieve the Australian 9th Division.

Under the command of Major General Ronald MacKenzie Scobie the 70th Division led the break out from Tobruk during Operation Crusader in order to link up with the Eighth Army. In the three day battle the lead battalions of the 70th Division (the 2nd Black Watch and the 2nd York and Lancs. Regt.) suffered heavy casualties.

After successfully linking up with Eighth Army the Division was sent back to Alexandria and then shipped to India after Japan entered the war by attacking British, Dutch and United States territories in South East Asia and the Pacific Ocean. On arrival in India, the division was first broken up and dispersed through Bengal, Assam and Bihar to perform internal security duties. Once the widespread disorders which resulted from the early British defeats in South East Asia and demands for the British to "Quit India" had died down, the division was concentrated for jungle training. Some units were briefly deployed to the Arakan front after a British offensive there was defeated in early 1943.

Late in 1943, Major General Orde Wingate secured approval for a major expansion of his "Special Force", widely known as the Chindits. As he refused to use British Indian Army units, the 70th Division was broken up on orders from the highest military authorities and absorbed into "Special Force" on October 25, 1943. This was carried out in spite of protests from General Claude Auchinleck, Commander-in-Chief in India and Lieutenant General William Slim, commanding the British Fourteenth Army, both of whom insisted that 70th Division could have far more value fighting as a cohesive, well-trained and battle-hardened formation than as part of the "Chindits".

Nevertheless, the units of 70th Division were reformed into Long Range Penetration formations for the Second Chindit Expedition of 1944 (Codenamed Operation Thursday).

[edit] Commanding officers10 Oct. 1941 - Maj-Gen Ronald Scobie
10 Feb. 1942 (acting) - Brig. C.E.N. Lomax
18 Feb. 1942 - Maj-Gen. G.W. Symes
[edit] Structure[edit] 14th Infantry BrigadeMain article: 14th Infantry Brigade
1st Battalion, Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire Regiment
2nd Battalion, York and Lancaster Regiment
2nd Battalion, Black Watch
[edit] 16th Infantry BrigadeMain article: 16th Infantry Brigade
2nd Battalion, The Leicestershire Regiment
2nd Battalion, Queen's Own Royal Regiment
2nd Battalion, King's Own Royal Regiment
[edit] 23rd Infantry Brigade 'Main article: 23rd Infantry Brigade
1st Battalion, Essex Regiment
1st Battalion, Durham Light Infantry
4th Battalion, The Border Regiment
[edit] Support Units45th Reconnaissance Regiment, Royal Armoured Corps
60th (North Midland) Field Regt. Royal Artillery
8th Field Regt. R.A.
51st (Westmoreland and Cumberland) Field Regt.R.A.
56th (King's Own) Anti-Tank Regt. R.A.
69th Light Anti-Aircraft/Anti-Tank Regt. R.A.
70th Infantry Division Signal Regiment - 10 Oct.1941 to 24 October 1943

[Capt Cliff]

Ok, I just found the wiki about the 70th and what brigades were attached to it. Well the 14th, 23rd and 16th, along with the 45th recon regmt, are sitting in Aden right now, game time, waiting to be transported to India. The unit organization of the brigade says nothing about them being a part of the 70th. An the 70th unit organization is under intensified. I'll stack them all and see if I can combine them, most likely I can't.

[awadley]

Not the way it works in AE. that is how the dev made the unit so that it would break down with the Chindit organization that was later used.

[JeffroK]

You get the HQ unit representing the Div Arty, Recce Bn etc plus 3 seperate independent Brigades representing the LRP structure.
 
There is no choice so you cant sent these units to Australia (for example) and have a standard British Infantry Division, the choice has been made for you.

[Capt Cliff]

ORIGINAL: JeffK

You get the HQ unit representing the Div Arty, Recce Bn etc plus 3 seperate independent Brigades representing the LRP structure.

There is no choice so you cant sent these units to Australia (for example) and have a standard British Infantry Division, the choice has been made for you.

Thanks, but it is a non standard format and it is not labeled as a HQ unit, it's an infantry unit but with no infantry. Perhaps a patch can fix this an allow these units to be combined when stacked together.

[oldman45]

A while back it was explained by Andy that the 70th was there kind of like a place holder for equipment that goes into formations that appear late in the war.

[vettim89]

ORIGINAL: Capt Cliff

ORIGINAL: JeffK

You get the HQ unit representing the Div Arty, Recce Bn etc plus 3 seperate independent Brigades representing the LRP structure.

There is no choice so you cant sent these units to Australia (for example) and have a standard British Infantry Division, the choice has been made for you.

Thanks, but it is a non standard format and it is not labeled as a HQ unit, it's an infantry unit but with no infantry. Perhaps a patch can fix this an allow these units to be combined when stacked together.

Another option would be to include the BGD with a withdraw date and then have a new 70th ID unit appear with just the HQ and support elements. This is how the withdraw of the Raider BTNs to form the 6th marines is dealt with in the game. Or just the usual answer to such questions - if you don't like it mod it

[JeffroK]

ORIGINAL: vettim89

ORIGINAL: Capt Cliff

ORIGINAL: JeffK

You get the HQ unit representing the Div Arty, Recce Bn etc plus 3 seperate independent Brigades representing the LRP structure.

There is no choice so you cant sent these units to Australia (for example) and have a standard British Infantry Division, the choice has been made for you.

Thanks, but it is a non standard format and it is not labeled as a HQ unit, it's an infantry unit but with no infantry. Perhaps a patch can fix this an allow these units to be combined when stacked together.

Another option would be to include the BGD with a withdraw date and then have a new 70th ID unit appear with just the HQ and support elements. This is how the withdraw of the Raider BTNs to form the 6th marines is dealt with in the game. Or just the usual answer to such questions - if you don't like it mod it

What I dont like is being forced down the historical timeline, in this case why cant I choose whether I want a standard Bde or a LRP Bde. the requirement depends on the situation. Why do I have to withdraw a LCU as against having a choice about Sqns and Ships. Maybe a restricted HQ to force you to pay through the nose to keep it, 5th Brit Div is also taken away from you. What if due to really stupid play you need US 3rd Division on map rather than send it to Europe. It needs a bit of work to get the processes right. To stop abuse I would have that you cant go into negative PP

[Sardaukar]

IIRC, 70th is intact in DaBigBabes and is handled bit differently.

If not liking it, edit it...though that requires very good knowledge of system.