OKH Plan 1942 - Alpha AAR

[ComradeP]

Jon, what's the primary impact of the really heavy guns in a city battle? Disabling enemy artillery and lowering the effectiveness of the other ground troops through bombardment fatique?

[PyleDriver]

Is that a question. Yep thats a question...Please guys...

[ComradeP]

If you don't want us to ask questions, don't mention something. If you mention you're bringing heavy guns, you can expect someone to ask what their value is. As tiresome as it is for you to see questions here, it's getting kind of tiresome that we have to ask questions related to what happens in your AAR in the Q&A thread.

[itsjustme]

ORIGINAL: ComradeP

If you don't want us to ask questions, don't mention something. If you mention you're bringing heavy guns, you can expect someone to ask what their value is. As tiresome as it is for you to see questions here, it's getting kind of tiresome that we have to ask questions related to what happens in your AAR in the Q&A thread.

Finally someone said it. Totally agree.

[PyleDriver]

(DAR) Balck blasted a hole and crossed the Moskva. 2nd PzA pulled up the right very well. 4th army made there stroke NW...I still have alot in store, but it's Monday morning and Steve needs his fix...lol...

[SNorth]

There is a second Steve (me) who needed his fix too---Thanks!

[SGHunt]

ORIGINAL: PyleDriver

2nd PzA pulled up the right very well.

Close but no coconut for 2nd Pz A (or for Hoth for that matter) - that link up was really needed to trap the last major grouping of troops S/SE of Moscow. Next week you will close it off but many of them will surely have legged it away by then?

Still, looking good though, Jon. There's nothing left in front of Hoth at present. Let's see what the Soviets can still whistle up in this, their most dire need. Are you sensing a mighty armoured counter-stroke or is he spent?

Can't wait to see Model's progress towards Hoth. From your last screen shot to the North of Moscow, it seemed as though there were fairly easy routes either North or South of the Uchinskoye V. reservoir, if you simply by-pass those last two big stacks the Russian has left.

It may be that, despite the strong warnings from Hard Sarge et al about attacking in mud, that that is what you will have to do to effect the link up, if you are left with just just one or two hexes between the two armies?

[PyleDriver]

(AAR) Model along with 3rd PzA spanked the front and sent alot of units to the rear. A small pocket was formed...If I only had 2 more weeks of good weather...Yes Stuart I didn't get to close that gap between 4th PzA and 2nd PzA...Hum, well lets see...

[SGHunt]

So just eighty miles, one or two rivers, and a lot of routed and aircraft units in between.   Nearly there.

Is it mud next turn or do you still have one turn of good weather?

Looking at the number of routed units on all sides of Moscow, and the way your assaults are rolling out, I sense that the defence is very close to cracking (or it may already have cracked?)

Any way for Kleist (and Armin) to join the party at this key moment?

[PyleDriver]

It's going to have to wait until the frost for this one, I never attack in mud. My railheads are in postion and I should jump off strong in November...

[PyleDriver]

(AAR) Kleist is still on the move. As I said he's rolling the line north. I'm sure he's quite the pest by now. BTW the 502nd Hvy PzB just seen action, they really helped in punching this hole...

[PyleDriver]

Heres the level 4 overview of the action...

[SGHunt]

Another good pocket and the Russians seem to have little left in the locker.   I know, I know - dangerous predictions when talking about Russia, but it does seem that there is simply too much going off everywhere, even down South, for the Russians to be in any position to mass their reserves.   If they can, and they should, it must be behind Moscow, and they must be committed very soon.   Maybe we'll see Hoth's final offensive smash straight into the Russian strategic reserve somewhere East of Moscow, in a kind of icy Prokhorovka?   The 'Battle of Orekhovo Zuevo' perhaps, where the rail line crosses the Klyazma due North of Hoth's leading Pz Korps?    (My spelling is struggling with German and Russian place names, old and new names etc.)

If the weather holds, then Kleist may make the Oka next turn?  Along with another large pocket.  And freeing up more infantry to support the encirclement.   On the other hand, if the Rasputitsa arrives, you have the Russians in that sack to the NW of Ryazan as they presumably will not be able to manoeuvre themselves out.

I'm still convinced that the 3rd Pz A's mobile units, supported by an Inf Korps, should be supporting Model's push East, not trying to cut though to 4th Army.   Model's  thrust is the key to the whole campaign now, surely?  

I understand the need to maintain pressure - you could still use the remaining two infantry Korps to scrap it out (at a fairly high cost, I accept) for a link up with the 4th?  They will at least pin the Russians in place.

[Neal_MLC]

I wonder if Stalin has hightailed it off to the Urals yet?  Yes I realize this is a question[:'(]

[SGHunt]

BTW is that Armin's 3rd SS Panzergrenadier-Division Totenkopf that is resting to the West of Torshok, or a new Division just in from OKH?  

[PyleDriver]

Tot SS is being recalled to Germany. I hate it but its true. Thus the red border. Next turn it hiper transports out to the west edge of the map...

[janh]

ORIGINAL: PyleDriver
Tot SS is being recalled to Germany. I hate it but its true. Thus the red border. Next turn it hiper transports out to the west edge of the map...

That's exactly why I don't like the new "transfer model", having removed the fictional fronts and HQ's in West and South Europe. In the strategic situation that yourself presently find you in, not even Hitler would have withdrawn Totenkopf now! And there can probably be not even a doubt about that. This kind of is a bummer now to loose Totenkopf for no reason.

[Smirfy]

ORIGINAL: janh

ORIGINAL: PyleDriver
Tot SS is being recalled to Germany. I hate it but its true. Thus the red border. Next turn it hiper transports out to the west edge of the map...

That's exactly why I don't like the new "transfer model", having removed the fictional fronts and HQ's in West and South Europe. In the strategic situation that yourself presently find you in, not even Hitler would have withdrawn Totenkopf now! And there can probably be not even a doubt about that. This kind of is a bummer now to loose Totenkopf for no reason.

Have to agree it seems like the system is bolted on. Divisions went west to rest, refit or defend other fronts. It would be better if the player could decide which units go west for a refit. For the off map fronts i'm not sure what would work best but the Theatre boxes wernt that bad.

[Naughteous Maximus]

Have to agree it seems like the system is bolted on. Divisions went west to rest, refit or defend other fronts. It would be better if the player could decide which units go west for a refit. For the off map fronts i'm not sure what would work best but the Theatre boxes wernt that bad.


I have to agree with Smirfy, I can't see the logic of divisions being removed from the front historically especially since the campaign in the east won't be fought historically. Too bad there isn't a way to decide whether a unit has a 50/50% of staying or withdrawing like with a dice roll.

[karonagames]

I think Jon would prefer this kind of discussion is held on separate threads, as he is focusing on giving you guys a top quality AAR.

Every alternate history can have fixed and variable parameters, and one of the parameters that is fixed in WITE is that all the other fronts are assumed to run historically. However the reinforcement/withdrawal schedule can be edited before the game starts. This could open a can of worms as you create a whole string of "what ifs" that have to be compensated for in other parts of the game data, such as if SS Totenkopf doesn't go to Italy/France, would Italy/France fall sooner - what would be the impact on production and logistics etc. etc.

There are more than enough variable parameters available to work with in the game mostly focused on Logistics and command and control.