The good way for Matrixgames

scimitar · Post by **scimitar** » Fri Oct 12, 2001 7:37 pm

I wish here explain my point of view: I think that Matrixgames is using the good politic for gamers when making "alliances" with good companies like Simulations Canada, SSG, and so on; and so doing creating as many various games as possible...
Let me explain: personnaly, I'm interrested by Steel Panthers (I love it since SP I...)and Combat Leader. I will buy each megacampaign CD for SP; and I will CERTAINLY buy Combat Leader. But I don't like (in fact, I really HATE!!!) real time games; and I don't like naval games as well. I will CERTAINLY NOT buy Close Assault, and others games...
But on the other hand I'm also conscient that other people disagree my point of view; they're liking real time, naval warfare, ...
I think that diversity is an excellent thing; for wargamers of course, but also in the general life.
I'm conscient that Matrixgames cannot survive for people like me ONLY. To survive; to grow (hope it!), Matrixgames have to find themas that will interrest many, many players other than me (and my little concept of computer wargaming)... Well, in fact I wil say that if Matrixgames can give some satisfaction to guys who have different meanings, it's a benefit for all, because new themas, new subjects, or simply new concept for some type of games will grow.
So, I really think that Matrixgames is on the right way; and I encourage everybody to support Matrixgames for what they're loving as style of game (to do so, BUY the style of game you like!!!)
but also to MORALY support Matrixgames for the games they don't like so much...

Les_the_Sarge_9_1 · Post by **Les_the_Sarge_9_1** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 1:13 am

Not quite the way I would have worded it heheh, but I also feel the way Scimitar does.

I think RTS sucks. But I dont see any point in expecting Martrix to avoid a style of game that is profitable. Business is about business.

Matrix is rapidly beoming my Avalon Hill. Still blue over the old AH going down the tubes like it did. But Matrix has done a great job of pleasing us total wargamers.

Marc von Martial · Post by **Marc von Martial** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 7:05 am

I think RTS sucks.

Hmmm, as one of the "few" guys coming from the "RTS" side working for Matrix, how do you define RTS Wargames. More like the C&C (spell Command & Conquer) genre or is for instance CC (spell Close Combat) also a "sucking" RTS ???

Cheers

scimitar · Post by **scimitar** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 3:38 pm

Well, I don't know for Les the Sarge, but for me all RTS are "sucking" RTS. I'm an old boardgamer (I was one of the first members of the first Belgian Wargamer's Federation in 1979); and for me turn-based games are the best.
... My son is a RTS inconditionnal, like Age of Empire, Total Annihilation, Tiberian Sun, Earth 2150,...
Sometimes I'm watching him when he's playing; nice play, but not for me.

Marc von Martial · Post by **Marc von Martial** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 4:06 pm

... My son is a RTS inconditionnal, like Age of Empire, Total Annihilation, Tiberian Sun, Earth 2150,...

LOL, I definetly agree that this branch of RTS games "sucks" <img src="wink.gif" border="0"> . Still a lot of poeple like to play them, which I can understand. I played a bit AoE times ago and I must say it had something addictive.

Close Combat is different it is "real time" yes, but doesn´t fit in the genre or "definition" of RTS games.

[ October 14, 2001: Message edited by: Marc Schwanebeck [GS_Marcks] ]</p>

nexus · Post by **nexus** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 7:16 pm

My son is a RTS inconditionnal, like Age of Empire, Total Annihilation, Tiberian Sun, Earth 2150,...
Sometimes I'm watching him when he's playing; nice play, but not for me.[/QB][/QUOTE]

hello.

the games you mention are more action with a little tactical moment....no real strategy.

all sorts of c+c did bore me fast
the same with a.o.e. I. or II
i tried some demos of other real time but i
found no one really interesting

perhaps the quite new "stronghold" can do better?

David Heath · Post by **David Heath** » Sun Oct 14, 2001 8:32 pm

Hi Guys

Matrix will use two systems in its RTS games. We feel gamers can enjoy RTS game and still leave an option for turn base players. Our RTS wargames will have an option called "time play". This will allow the gamers the option to fully play RTS or have a plot timer. Allowing the players to plot there moves and then excute the turn. So keep your eyes on our RTS games you maybe surprise.

Les_the_Sarge_9_1 · Post by **Les_the_Sarge_9_1** » Mon Oct 15, 2001 4:08 pm

hello again.

When I made the comment "RTS sucks" I was of course refering to the style where you chase any unit around in real time mode and or first person mode.
I am not saying these games are poorly made or even poorly liked, clearly they are or they wouldnt sell. Me I just dont like them. My buddies are always gushing over one and , well, sorry guys, I just dont like them.

But then again, I dont like watching sports, I dont drink several beers each and every weekend. I dont smoke or indulge in substances not allowed currently by society as well. I dont like modern comic books, and I find most modern horror films to be incredibly crummy. And wrestling is to painfully dumb to endure.

Its just me.

I eat an astounding weight of chocolate. I think peanut butter and jam sandwiches are a perfect default meal. I like to play rolegames with buddies and eat lots of pop and chips even at my age. I enjoy watching anime shows, especially the ones that are silly romantic comedies. I have an obsession with documentaries especially anything to do with earth sciences. I own more plastic models than on average 20 normal hobbists.

So while I say RTS sucks. I am only saying I wont play one regardless of how "good" it may look. Its just not me. RTS is anything where I dont get to move my pieces then you then me then you etc continue.... I like to play Heroes of Might and Magic, but its just a funny sort of wargame. I think Call to Power 2 is a great game, but again its just a turn based war game. I have seen the online game WW2 and likely wouldnt play it if you bought me a new computer and payed for my online time.

I suppose if Matrix is here because of a large amount of Steel Panthers players, then its fan base is potentially turn based fanatics.
I only play a computer game when I cant find a FTF opponent.
Saturday I encountered a player that found me through MMP's ASL directory. It was potentially the best day of the year. I hope to get in a few more games with this person.
But I can realise that most youths today, wouldnt play ASL unless their father was punishing them and forcing them to do it. It has I guess something to do with actually having to read the rules and actually requiring the person to play the game correctly or not at all possibly (ASL doesnt come with a "preferences" function heheh , maybe a few optional rules at best).

scimitar · Post by **scimitar** » Mon Oct 15, 2001 10:55 pm

To Les the Sarge: never tried Belgian chocolate? The best of the world... <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

Caltone · Post by **Caltone** » Mon Oct 15, 2001 11:14 pm

I was/am of the opinion that RTS "sucks" as well, until I first played SM's Gettysburg.

The Close Combat series also deserves note.

Nikademus · Post by **Nikademus** » Tue Oct 16, 2001 1:33 am

Originally posted by scimitar:
Let me explain: personnaly, I'm interrested by Steel Panthers (I love it since SP I...)and Combat Leader. I will buy each megacampaign CD for SP; and I will CERTAINLY buy Combat Leader. But I don't like (in fact, I really HATE!!!) real time games; and I don't like naval games as well. I will CERTAINLY NOT buy Close Assault, and others games...
...

Listen to the souuund of my voice.....you LIKE naval wargames. You WANT a good modern designed naval wargame. Not icky 'real time' style naval wargames, but juicy, engaging turn-based naval wargames.

wargames with big battleships, the "tanks" of the sea, trading salvoes with enemy battleships as they vie for control of the seas.

without control of the seas, your troops will never get those tanks you keep signing out of the motor pool everytime you boot up a game of SP.

<img src="biggrin.gif" border="0">

now envision Matrix creating such a game. yes.....it is bliss.

<img src="tongue.gif" border="0">

scimitar · Post by **scimitar** » Tue Oct 16, 2001 9:39 am

To Nikademus, I've heard the sound of your voice <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0"> <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0"> <img src="biggrin.gif" border="0">
Sure, you're right; naval wargames are very interrestive. But I'm more a "land wargamer" than a "naval" one.
Perheaps is that fact due to the "Belgian reality": battlefield of Europe during centuries; well placed to appreciate <img src="confused.gif" border="0"> Napoleonic warfare (my ancestors inhabited Ligny in 1815), WWi and WWii boardgames...

degen · Post by **degen** » Wed Oct 17, 2001 9:12 am

Originally posted by David Heath:
Hi Guys

Matrix will use two systems in its RTS games. We feel gamers can enjoy RTS game and still leave an option for turn base players. Our RTS wargames will have an option called "time play". This will allow the gamers the option to fully play RTS or have a plot timer. Allowing the players to plot there moves and then excute the turn. So keep your eyes on our RTS games you maybe surprise.

The "plot timer" option reminds me of the system used in the old Sniper and Patrol board games by SPI. This was a cool feature and made you carefully think your moves to out guess where your opponent would go. When things got tight you would often find yourself either with the enemy behind you and you facing the wrong way or vice versa.