Books about the European air war
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Books about the European air war
I'm looking for the best book or two about the WW2 air war in Europe. I'm mostly interested in the allied bombing campaign. At Borders today I saw "Masters of the Air" about the 8th Air Force, and "Fire and Fury" about the overall allied campaign. Has anyone read these or anything else they can recommend?
- greg_slith
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RE: Books about the European air war
I just finished "Fire and Fury". It was not very kind to Bomber Harris. It gave some nice insight for the "Big Picture" types. I would have like more detail about the raids themselves but this wasn't the scope the auther had in mind. Basically he felt the area bombing was a HUGE waste of men, money and material. Not to mention morally questionable. This was one of the (very) few books that I have read which suggested that the 8th AF was actually successful by going the precision route. There were some very moving stories about German civilians living through the attacks The book "The Bomber War" by Robin Neillands was pretty good. More action if you will.
RE: Books about the European air war
King;
There was a two volume set -- decades ago -- called "The AirWar", author was Jablonski (sp?) I've never found a "really good" one that covered everything.
8th AF=> "Mighty Eighth" R. Freeman
Bomber Cmd=> "Bomber Offensive", A. Harris
Luftwaffe=>"First and Last", A. Galland
I've not found anything good for the other major commands.
But there are some good individual Unit Histories, Battles, and personal accounts.
My favorite is probably the novel, "Twelve O'Clock High!", B. Lay
TS
There was a two volume set -- decades ago -- called "The AirWar", author was Jablonski (sp?) I've never found a "really good" one that covered everything.
8th AF=> "Mighty Eighth" R. Freeman
Bomber Cmd=> "Bomber Offensive", A. Harris
Luftwaffe=>"First and Last", A. Galland
I've not found anything good for the other major commands.
But there are some good individual Unit Histories, Battles, and personal accounts.
My favorite is probably the novel, "Twelve O'Clock High!", B. Lay
TS
RE: Books about the European air war
Martin Middlebrook wrote some good books about both Bomber Command and 8th AF. He covers the raids from both sides so you get the LW pov too.
A very good novel is Deighton's Bomber
A very good novel is Deighton's Bomber
"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.
RE: Books about the European air war
Don't know if it's still available, but I have a book I constantly refer to - great read. "Escort to Berlin" (4th fighter group in WWII) by Garry L. Fry & Jeffrey L. Ethell. Publisher ARCO Publishing Inc, 219 Park Avenue South, New York, ISBN 0-668-04768-2.
Now the book I have in my hand was published in 1980 in the US. I got it 2nd hand in a UK bookshop, and it now resides with me in Australia!!! More a unit operational diary/history, but gives some excellent first hand accounts and a real feel for those bombing raids into Europe!
An excellent publisher of war related books is Grub Street. Check out their website:-
http://www.grubstreet.co.uk/
They have distributors around the world.
Now the book I have in my hand was published in 1980 in the US. I got it 2nd hand in a UK bookshop, and it now resides with me in Australia!!! More a unit operational diary/history, but gives some excellent first hand accounts and a real feel for those bombing raids into Europe!
An excellent publisher of war related books is Grub Street. Check out their website:-
http://www.grubstreet.co.uk/
They have distributors around the world.
RE: Books about the European air war
I'd recommend:
"Bomber Command" Max Hastings
"The Bomber War" Robin Neillands
"Masters of the Air" Donald Miller
For a day to day look at tactical ops, Christopher Shores has a 3 volume series on the 2nd Tactical AF, and also has an interesting book on the air war on the West Front and Norway prior to the Blitzkrieg, "Fledgling Eagles"
"Bomber Command" Max Hastings
"The Bomber War" Robin Neillands
"Masters of the Air" Donald Miller
For a day to day look at tactical ops, Christopher Shores has a 3 volume series on the 2nd Tactical AF, and also has an interesting book on the air war on the West Front and Norway prior to the Blitzkrieg, "Fledgling Eagles"
- Hard Sarge
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RE: Books about the European air war
4 vol now
anything by Shores is good, but more for the details, then the overall doings
most of what I have been getting lately is detail/unit stuff, but there are alot of good general books out there too
(oboy, speaking of, just got my copy of Lornant/Goyat's book on JG 300)
(and my copy of Rocky Horror pitcher show DVD !)
anything by Shores is good, but more for the details, then the overall doings
most of what I have been getting lately is detail/unit stuff, but there are alot of good general books out there too
(oboy, speaking of, just got my copy of Lornant/Goyat's book on JG 300)
(and my copy of Rocky Horror pitcher show DVD !)
RE: Books about the European air war
Kingwanabee;
A good thing about BoB/BtR is if you read some of the operational level books, it gives you something to try in the game, too!
Middlebrook's description about standard night ops in "The Nuremberg Raid" has become my standard in BtR.
Now, if someone knows a good book on the Tactical AF's.
It's been two weeks since the invasion, and I've had nothing but crap weather!
The Germans have had a free ride in getting to Normandy, and the wall is well built.
TS
A good thing about BoB/BtR is if you read some of the operational level books, it gives you something to try in the game, too!
Middlebrook's description about standard night ops in "The Nuremberg Raid" has become my standard in BtR.
Now, if someone knows a good book on the Tactical AF's.
It's been two weeks since the invasion, and I've had nothing but crap weather!
The Germans have had a free ride in getting to Normandy, and the wall is well built.
TS
RE: Books about the European air war
Try the "Right of the Line" by John Terraine for an overall history of the RAF in World War 2.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Right-Line-Word ... 1853266833
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Right-Line-Word ... 1853266833
RE: Books about the European air war
One of my favorites is Peter Hinchliffe's "The Other Battle" (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0760302650/danielosterma-20). Although it's focused more on the Nachtjagd, it's well-balanced and gives a good portrayal of the overall ebb and flow of the night bombing campaign from both sides. And as somebody already mentioned, you can't really go wrong with Middlebrook.
TechSgt mentioned Galland's "The First and The Last"...I've read it, good book, but I caution people to approach it with a grain of salt, as like almost all post-war memoirs (Harris' "Bomber Command" as well) it's occasionally more self-serving than accurate.
TechSgt mentioned Galland's "The First and The Last"...I've read it, good book, but I caution people to approach it with a grain of salt, as like almost all post-war memoirs (Harris' "Bomber Command" as well) it's occasionally more self-serving than accurate.
RE: Books about the European air war
ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge
4 vol now
anything by Shores is good, but more for the details, then the overall doings
most of what I have been getting lately is detail/unit stuff, but there are alot of good general books out there too
(oboy, speaking of, just got my copy of Lornant/Goyat's book on JG 300)
(and my copy of Rocky Horror pitcher show DVD !)
four now? well guess that makes it 3 books to go to complete my Shores collection [:D]
Black Cross/Red Star vol's 2-4 first though.
- Hard Sarge
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RE: Books about the European air war
the 4th is not like the others, it is camo and unit data stuff, good to have, but the first 3 tell the story
those Cross/Star can be HARD to find, and if you do, going to cost you, the main writer has a new set of books out, using alot of the info from them
the books from Prien and Lorant are great for detail and inside info on the units
of course it depends on what info you are looking for or want to read
I got a book, that lists all of the crew losses from BC, nothing but pages of names, great book for what it is, but very depressing to open up and look at
something like 57,000 dead crew members listed
those Cross/Star can be HARD to find, and if you do, going to cost you, the main writer has a new set of books out, using alot of the info from them
the books from Prien and Lorant are great for detail and inside info on the units
of course it depends on what info you are looking for or want to read
I got a book, that lists all of the crew losses from BC, nothing but pages of names, great book for what it is, but very depressing to open up and look at
something like 57,000 dead crew members listed
RE: Books about the European air war
I hope it can help:
1) Andreews Brokes, Air War over Italy, 43-45. Ian Allan Ed, 2000
2) Alfred Price, Battle over the Reich, vol. 1 and 2; Ian Allan Ed, 2005-6
3) Chris Dunning, Courage Alone, Italian Air Force 40-43, Hikoky, 1998
4) Murray, Strategy for defeat: Luftwaffe 39-45, Air Univ. Press, 1983
5) David Wragg, Raf handbook, 39-45; Sutton Publ., 2007
6) Lake, The Battle of Britain, Armeer Book, 2000
7) Murray, War in the Air 14-45; Cassel, 1999
[8D]
ht.
1) Andreews Brokes, Air War over Italy, 43-45. Ian Allan Ed, 2000
2) Alfred Price, Battle over the Reich, vol. 1 and 2; Ian Allan Ed, 2005-6
3) Chris Dunning, Courage Alone, Italian Air Force 40-43, Hikoky, 1998
4) Murray, Strategy for defeat: Luftwaffe 39-45, Air Univ. Press, 1983
5) David Wragg, Raf handbook, 39-45; Sutton Publ., 2007
6) Lake, The Battle of Britain, Armeer Book, 2000
7) Murray, War in the Air 14-45; Cassel, 1999
[8D]
ht.
RE: Books about the European air war
Rocky Horror Picture Show .... I remember going to that 25 yrs ago when i was a teenager a little botique theatre used to run late shows , When they drank a toast everybody threw burnt toast when it was raining the water bottles went and so did the newspapers over the head and evrybody did the time warp .... a hell of a lot of fun
Who was in it ...... Susan Sarandon .... Barry Bosworth the mayor of that comedy show .... Meatloaf who else
All in all good clean fun ....great movie
Who was in it ...... Susan Sarandon .... Barry Bosworth the mayor of that comedy show .... Meatloaf who else
All in all good clean fun ....great movie
Mike Blair CROCKY
- Hard Sarge
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RE: Books about the European air war
ORIGINAL: Crocky
Rocky Horror Picture Show .... I remember going to that 25 yrs ago when i was a teenager a little botique theatre used to run late shows , When they drank a toast everybody threw burnt toast when it was raining the water bottles went and so did the newspapers over the head and evrybody did the time warp .... a hell of a lot of fun
Who was in it ...... Susan Sarandon .... Barry Bosworth the mayor of that comedy show .... Meatloaf who else
All in all good clean fun ....great movie
you missing the main one Tim Curry !
(and strangely, I think it ruined his career)
I seen it father back then that, before it got into that cult thing, LOL, 3 Marines and we are not sure what the heck is going on, your not sure if you should try and slip out the side door, or sit there and watch it
maybe I will even get a chance to watch it
RE: Books about the European air war
ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge
the 4th is not like the others, it is camo and unit data stuff, good to have, but the first 3 tell the story
those Cross/Star can be HARD to find, and if you do, going to cost you, the main writer has a new set of books out, using alot of the info from them
Tell me about it. Vol one of cross/star holds the record of most expensive book purchase thus far, even beating out the rare Shores out of print books.
ah well. was worth it. Did check out his new set of books but they were reputed to be more snapshot based and i wanted the detail.
- Hard Sarge
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RE: Books about the European air war
one forum I go to, a lot of the writers post there, was asking about one book, and how much it costs when I could find it, the guy who wrote it came up and said, it was worth every penny !, I tried to keep him talking to see if he had any of his own, he could sell, 350, buying it from Enland wasn't going to get it (I did end up finding it by chance, and for around 35, good book)
still, I think the best story, I was looking for Aces, and one pilot showed he was a Ace with a set number of kills, but he only had so many while flying with the HQs, but none with any of the squadrons
so asked politely what the story was, did he get some kills someplace else or what ?
somebody came back and pretty much gave me his whole life's history, much more detailed then you would expect, then noticed that the guys name was the same, it was his son, he then send me some info on his father and some others in the FG and mentioned he had wrote a book, if I wanted more details, found it and ordered it, very good, very detailed about the 355th fG
still, I think the best story, I was looking for Aces, and one pilot showed he was a Ace with a set number of kills, but he only had so many while flying with the HQs, but none with any of the squadrons
so asked politely what the story was, did he get some kills someplace else or what ?
somebody came back and pretty much gave me his whole life's history, much more detailed then you would expect, then noticed that the guys name was the same, it was his son, he then send me some info on his father and some others in the FG and mentioned he had wrote a book, if I wanted more details, found it and ordered it, very good, very detailed about the 355th fG
- Hard Sarge
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RE: Books about the European air war
ahh great, thanks for posting, I had lost that forum when my computer crashed and didn't remember the name of it, you got me to go hunting for it
RE: Books about the European air war
i kind of shy away from books dedicated only to a specific group (otherwise my library would need a new condo!) so hopefully the books i've collected thus far suffice in terms of reletive accuracy. Couple of exceptions of course......have the bio on JG26 and was amazed to verify in Shores that one of their Staffels really did do what the book claimed they did during a four month period over Malta. [:D]
I could imagine the hoots it would have produced had i quoted it alone on a forum.
I could imagine the hoots it would have produced had i quoted it alone on a forum.
- krishub1492
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RE: Books about the European air war
I would recommend "Air War Europa" by Eric Hammel and "Carl A. Spaatz and the Air War in Europe" by Richard G. Davis.