Enough already!

[Arsan]

ORIGINAL: Llyranor

Yeah, It Never Snows in September is a pretty good book. The paperback version I have could use some better maps, though.

Yes, it seems therr are two paperback editions.
The on i have (and posted the link above) its just like the hardback, with lots of photos, colour maps and glossy hihg quality paper.
But the new paperback edition (somewhat cheaper and with black&withe cover) seems to have no photos and only black&wite maps. A shame [:(]

[Llyranor]

Heh, I'd actually be tempted to rebuy the book, then.

So, this one has all the pictures and color maps? I'm just checking, since one of the comments criticizes the lack of those (but could be referring to the other paperback).

This is the one I own, which has none of those

[Arsan]

Yes, indeed.
I have the one in the top on paperback and seem to be an exact copy of the hardback edition... but without hardback.[;)]
Page paper is glossy and thick, and it has lots of photos and colour maps. And its was not so expensive for what i recall. And excellent edition! [&o]
The one in the bottom is a newer edition (i just noticed it existed yesterday while checking for a link to post).
Regarding the reviews, amazon use to mix different editions comments all together but the b/w maps and no photos is referring to the new one. [:)]

Cheers!

[Llyranor]

Many thanks! I really enjoyed the book content, but was disappointed since all the photos from the text descriptions weren't included, and I had to check out other references when locations were mentioned given the relative lack of maps.

[Wirraway_Ace]

ORIGINAL: SS Hauptsturmfuhrer

If you look at the casualties in the Arnhem campaign, though significant for the allies because of the high value paratroopers involved and the expenditure of resources, on the Russian front such losses could be shrugged off as usual for a week or less of normal combat action... 

The losses to the British 1st Abn Div weren't really the issue for the Allies in operation Market Garden; although by this time, any British troop losses were problematic. The real issue was psychological. Many of the soldiers and leaders thought the Germany Army was broken, incapable of further effective resistance, and victory was weeks or a few months away. Both Market Garden and the Bulge were important because they signalled there was still a lot of fighting to be done and interesting because effective German combat operations seemed so improbable.

A comparision of the number of mechanized and motorized vehicles just in 30 Corps to the total available to the German Army in the west is enlightening.

[V22 Osprey]

You guys do know there is a recent military history book thread right?

[Canoerebel]

Had I been an Allied soldier somewhere in France after the Allies broke out of Normandy and Patton went racing through countryside, and had I watched as thousands of smiling, relieved German prisoners walked by, I too would have thought the war was about over.

[anarchyintheuk]

ORIGINAL: SS Hauptsturmfuhrer

ORIGINAL: Arsan

ORIGINAL: SS Hauptsturmfuhrer

I'm not a huge fan of either Arnhem or the Bulge although I've seen documentaries and read books on both.  For an axis fan, they are not so wonderful cause of the terrible waste in the Bulge and the small scale of Arnhem. 

Hi!

There is an excellent book about Market Garden strictly from the german perspective that may interest you

"It never snows in september" by Robert Kershaw
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Never-Snows-Sep ... 118&sr=8-7

It's a great and detailed account of how the remains of the German army, completely defeated after Normandy managed to organize a defence that stopped the allied elite parachute and armoured divisions.
An excellent read and ideal companion book to fully enjoy Panther games "Highway to the Reich" game [&o]

Cheers

I've heard that snow book mentioned a lot so it must be a good one. The author was speaking in a documentary I saw on Arnhem; I think it was Battlefield Detectives.

Battlefield Detectives is one of the better series I've seen. At least they limit themselves to plausable or hypothetical reasons why something occurred and stay away from the History Channel's usual suspects: extraterrestrials and paranormal activity.

[SS Hauptsturmfuhrer]

ORIGINAL: anarchyintheuk

ORIGINAL: SS Hauptsturmfuhrer

ORIGINAL: Arsan



Hi!

There is an excellent book about Market Garden strictly from the german perspective that may interest you

"It never snows in september" by Robert Kershaw
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Never-Snows-Sep ... 118&sr=8-7

It's a great and detailed account of how the remains of the German army, completely defeated after Normandy managed to organize a defence that stopped the allied elite parachute and armoured divisions.
An excellent read and ideal companion book to fully enjoy Panther games "Highway to the Reich" game [&o]

Cheers

I've heard that snow book mentioned a lot so it must be a good one. The author was speaking in a documentary I saw on Arnhem; I think it was Battlefield Detectives.

Battlefield Detectives is one of the better series I've seen. At least they limit themselves to plausable or hypothetical reasons why something occurred and stay away from the History Channel's usual suspects: extraterrestrials and paranormal activity.

Ya it is very interesting documentary. My favorite one is the about the Apache. It was cool how a few dozen Apache warriors could use Sun Tsu tactics and the terrain to outwit american armies sent to eradicate them.

[Chijohnaok2]

ORIGINAL: chijohnaok

ORIGINAL: V22 Osprey

How about a ''something other than WWII'' Campaign game?[:'(]

Yeah!!!! Can we maybe get comprehensive game covering the Anglo-Zanzibar War .

Maybe 3-4 scenarios, in addition to a full blown campaign.

I guess no one caught the irony of asking for a 3-4 scenario/full blown campaign game of a war that only lasted 38 minutes long.........

[Llyranor]

ORIGINAL: Arsan

Yes, indeed.
I have the one in the top on paperback and seem to be an exact copy of the hardback edition... but without hardback.[;)]
Page paper is glossy and thick, and it has lots of photos and colour maps. And its was not so expensive for what i recall. And excellent edition! [&o]
The one in the bottom is a newer edition (i just noticed it existed yesterday while checking for a link to post).
Regarding the reviews, amazon use to mix different editions comments all together but the b/w maps and no photos is referring to the new one. [:)]

Cheers!

Just bumping this to give Arsan a big thanks! The new book just came in the mail, and the extra maps/photos are really great! Really appreciate it!

[Arsan]

Glad you liked it! [:)]
(after buying the same book twice if you didn't i woudl feel sooo guilty! [:(][:D])
Cheers!

[SlickWilhelm]

ORIGINAL: chijohnaok



I guess no one caught the irony of asking for a 3-4 scenario/full blown campaign game of a war that only lasted 38 minutes long.........

I caught it. I chuckled, but didn't think it was worth replying. But I learned about a war that I previously known nothing about. [:)]

[jackx]

I had to look it up, then grinned - but didn't think it warranted an extra reply. I arrived at that conclusion because no-one else commented on it, and I couldn't shake the feeling that I was the only one who had to look it up, thus possibly embarrasing myself... 

[laika]

ORIGINAL: jackx

MMORPG addicts aren't exactly casual gamers, and probably have about the same level of overall social acceptance as hardcore wargamers, with the added disadvantage that you can probably be the latter a lot easier while maintaining some semblance of a "normal" social life.

Yes, wargamers and wargame developers have a habit to be grognards and act like an arrogant elite. Maybe that cost them the chance to become more accepted by the mainstream, but if that chance was there, it was there in the late '90s/early 2000s, and by now has passed the genre by. While gaming wasn't yet fully acceptable into the "mainstream", establishing a foothold with niché products could've worked. Now, when you pretty much have to play games (or be aware of them) to "fit in", niché products are pushed to the side more and more.

Maybe, with demographic change (and the current 15-29 "casual gamers" growing up mentally at some point), there'll be another chance. Wargames also have about 0 marketability for e-sports, which denies them another way in which they could gain more mainstream exposure and acceptance.

Yes MMorpg gamers aren´t casual gamers. Like myself i played alot EVE online a couple of years ago and had to stop with that one because i had problems with my wife and kids because i spend so much time in it. I also used EVE as a chat programm. And don,t think it was a easy game when you want to run such a game with a great income and econemy. Alot game types are for a niche market like the wargames, train and flight sims etc. The point with gaming is the time you have in RL to spend for games. I also played alot of CMOBB years ago but now i just dont have the time to play that kind of games in the way i want them to play. So now i choose more simple games like the CC (COI, i realy love it)series and the Panzer Command series because they give me just the perfect difficulty for the time i can spend for gaming to keep also my family happy.
Btw more eastern wargames would be great. I really would like to see a game that also includes the battle in the Crimea like the battle of Sevastopol