Coastal defense guns

This new stand alone release based on the legendary War in the Pacific from 2 by 3 Games adds significant improvements and changes to enhance game play, improve realism, and increase historical accuracy. With dozens of new features, new art, and engine improvements, War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition brings you the most realistic and immersive WWII Pacific Theater wargame ever!

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Fallschirmjager
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Coastal defense guns

Post by Fallschirmjager »

Are these still as massivly effective in the late war as they are in stock WitP? Playing from late 43 onwards as the Allies. I find coastal defense guns do the bulk of damage to my forces. I can bomb them from the air and from the sea for weeks prepping for an invasion and they still do massive damage to my invasion fleets.
How have beta testers found their effectiveness so far?
spence
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by spence »

USN losses to Japanese coast defense guns were quite small (especially if one excludes the small auxiliaries (YMS and such) that were lost in Manila Bay when Bataan and Corregidor surrendered. Again other than a couple of minesweepers lost in Manila Bay in 1942, Japanese CD guns only accounted for 3 other minesweepers throughout the war. Mines themselves accounted for more losses amongst minesweepers...yet I have only seen one minesweeper hit a mine in hundreds of turns of playing.

The following link shows cause of loss of all USN/USCG ships in WWII:

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq82-1.htm

I have noticed that Japanese minesweepers seem to be able to regularly sweep mines while the Allied CD gunners are at tea or attending a lecture on prophylaxis or some such.
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XENXEN
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by XENXEN »

Well spence he did not ask about what happened during the second world war but how they work in witp AE verses stock witp. Something i would like to know to 
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Fallschirmjager
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by Fallschirmjager »

ORIGINAL: XENXEN

Well spence he did not ask about what happened during the second world war but how they work in witp AE verses stock witp. Something i would like to know to 

Actually I am very glad he told me that information. I really did not know if late war island assualts produced heavy losses to coastal guns or not.
I am of the strong opinion that coastal guns in WitP are far too strong and need to be nerfed.
I am NOT talking about coastal guns in forts like Pearl Harbour or Singapore or Manilla or mainland Japan. Those guns should have a high degree of effectivness. I am talking about coastal defense units that can be loaded onto ships and dumped off at an island. If these units are not supressed by air power and sea bombardment they should be effective. If they are heavily bombed or not in 5+ fortifications then they should not be able to hit too many ships.
Dili
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by Dili »

The US ships took hits from German and French guns in D-Day and Torch. In both it was considered that the results were not good.
John Lansford
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by John Lansford »

I had an amphibious TF decimated by CD guns when I invaded Saipan in my last game to reach 1944.  Probably 2/3 of the ships had 20%+ SYS and Flot damage despite my having a strong bombardment TF hitting the island for days in advance, plus heavy bomber strikes from nearby bases, plus carrier airstrikes.

I've also seen an IJN CA TF get its butt handed to it by the Manila coast defenses when for some wierd reason they tried to bombard Bataan.  The AAR showed every cruiser had taken multiple hits, although none were sunk.

IRL, big CD guns got special treatment by the bombardment TF's, but there were also few of those 'big guns' that were challenged directly.  IIRC the 8" guns on Tarawa were the only Pacific CD guns that size that fired at an invasion fleet.  In the Atlantic the Germans had many much better gun positions defending the beaches, yet they were still unable to inflict serious damage on any Allied invasion fleet.  Then there's the Norwegian CD positions at Oslo that sank Blucher and damaged some other ships; she was probably the biggest ship sunk by CD forces in the entire war in fact.
Dili
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by Dili »

What ultimately sunk Blucher were ground based torpedos.
spence
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RE: Coastal defense guns

Post by spence »

The RL results obtained by Japanese shore batteries against amphibious invasions were pretty unimpressive. The fly by night amphib operation the Japanese tried to pull off against Wake on Dec 11th 41 got its head handed to it though. But other than at Wake the IJN pretty much tried to steer clear of CD guns. In this it succeeded for the most part because of the paucity of CD defenses in the Pacific. The Singapore and Corregidor forts where not challenged...with good reason...the IJN never developed any significant doctrine and consequent technology/training for the cooperation of its gunships with its own landing forces (to say nothing of cooperating with the IJA). In contrast the USN developed all of the above. As an example; once Gen Kuribayashi allowed his guns to fire on the Marines at Iwo Jima the Americans were able to focus such firepower on the gun positions so rapidly that 50% of the Japanese guns (by Kuribayashi's own writing) were disabled withing 24 hours (mostly due to crew losses).
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