Surrounded Forces wont surrender!

[undercovergeek]

Stock 42a campaign - its a chinese city cant remember which one but its mine - Japanese, and in my posession, i have a stack of 340k troops against a stack of 60k Chinese divisions, i constantly get 15-1 odds and kill 1-2k troops a turn, it has to be out of supply, its my city and its completely surrounded - why wont it surrender - the exact same process worked in the previous city further up the railway - but these guys wont give it up

[spence]

Given Japan's record with prisoners, particularly Chinese prisoners, perhaps the surrounded troops see that there is no benefit whatsoever to surrendering.

Actually, since the city is yours, I think the computer is considering the battle to be taking place in the countryside. Surrenders seem to be a phenomena associated with the "outnumbered" forces also being the owners of the base.

[wdolson]

It's an old bug in the original game. I remember finding it in AE and fixing it.

The fix may make it into the 1.807 patch for WitP. That's up to Joe and Yamato Hugger, they are making all the calls on what goes into that patch.

Bill

[rominet]

You have to reach a ratio of 100/1 or bigger to see chinese troups surrender.

[undercovergeek]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

It's an old bug in the original game. I remember finding it in AE and fixing it.

The fix may make it into the 1.807 patch for WitP. That's up to Joe and Yamato Hugger, they are making all the calls on what goes into that patch.

Bill

so it is the fact that the game sees them as being in the country?

ORIGINAL: rominet
You have to reach a ratio of 100/1 or bigger to see chinese troups surrender.

youre kidding me?

[rtrapasso]

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek

ORIGINAL: wdolson

It's an old bug in the original game. I remember finding it in AE and fixing it.

The fix may make it into the 1.807 patch for WitP. That's up to Joe and Yamato Hugger, they are making all the calls on what goes into that patch.

Bill

so it is the fact that the game sees them as being in the country?

ORIGINAL: rominet
You have to reach a ratio of 100/1 or bigger to see chinese troups surrender.

youre kidding me?

Actually, you pretty much have to eliminate supplies and their morale... you can do it much more economically but it takes a lot of time.

[rominet]

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek

ORIGINAL: wdolson

It's an old bug in the original game. I remember finding it in AE and fixing it.

The fix may make it into the 1.807 patch for WitP. That's up to Joe and Yamato Hugger, they are making all the calls on what goes into that patch.

Bill

so it is the fact that the game sees them as being in the country?

ORIGINAL: rominet
You have to reach a ratio of 100/1 or bigger to see chinese troups surrender.

youre kidding me?

Sorry no, it is not a joke. rtrapasso is right.
You may attack them and weaken them until a big ratio is reached.
Use plane and bombardement, ground attack at some times and progressively, you will see ennemy units, one by one, to surrender.
As rtrapasso said, it will take you a lot of time.

[wdolson]

ORIGINAL: wdolson

It's an old bug in the original game. I remember finding it in AE and fixing it.

The fix may make it into the 1.807 patch for WitP. That's up to Joe and Yamato Hugger, they are making all the calls on what goes into that patch.

Bill

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek
so it is the fact that the game sees them as being in the country?

I'm not quite sure of your question. A unit is more likely to surrender the turn a base falls. The bug had to do with casualties taken by isolated units, not surrender.

Bill

[undercovergeek]

just before you replied spence mentioned that if he remembered correctly it was because the map saw them as in country because it was my city they were in, and then you said, its a known bug - i suppose im just confirming that you were saying the bug is the map sees them as in country, OR are you saying its simply a bug that they wont surrender unless its their own city theyve been defeated in?!?!? phew

[wdolson]

Land combat has two phases, the first phase is where the units shoot at one another and the second is where the odds are calculated and based on the odds (and randoms), various things are determined like whether a base changes hands and retreat/surrender/banzai.

The bug I found was in the phase where units are shooting at one another.  Isolated units were much less vulnerable to taking losses than units under normal conditions.  That has been fixed in AE.

The retreat/surrender/banzai criteria has not changed as far as I can tell (I haven't seen the original code from WitP, only AE's code).  There is a test at the end of a turn on isolated units to see if they disappear, but they have to be in pretty bad shape to completely fold.  I remember seeing the messages from isolated units dying in WitP, so it is in WitP.

With the fix I made, isolated units will take higher casualties when attacked, which will quicken their demise though there won't be any extra retreat/surrender checks. 

Bill