You have got to be kidding me.

Gary Grigsby's strategic level wargame covering the entire War in the Pacific from 1941 to 1945 or beyond.

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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by BrucePowers »

Yeah, me too[:D]
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Knavey »

ORIGINAL: bobogoboom

i know the history channel is the ufo and big foot channel. but seriously they have pearl harbor(the worst movie ever made) on tonight. everyone at that network need to be rounded up and summarily beaten. there is no way they should be allowed to be called the history channel.

I was "arguing" one time with a fellow at work about something WW2 related. I cannot remember what it was, but in the middle of it he quoted a fact and I asked him what his source was. His reply..."I saw it on the History Channel!". That was the end of that discussion.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Bobthehatchit »

I aside from the above mentioned floors i have to ask....


You have just been attacked, had half your fleet blown to hell to... not to mention most of your available aircraft.... do you take two of the very small number of fighter pilots with air to air combat experience.... and stick them into B25 and send them on a virtual suicide mission flying off carrier to bomb Japan .....

I think not.....

I’d rather watch Battle of the Bulge, than the film that shall not be mentioned!
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Ambassador »

Actually, if you skip every scene that has a plane in it, or a warship (modern or genuine), this film makes a rather good movie.  A sentimental drama movie off course, aka love movie, aka the "make your GF happy" movie.  It has some usefulness, if only to get a few hours to make some turns of WitP.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Terminus »

Sigh... Silly as the film is, it's not fair to compare it to war films, given that it's no more a war film than Gone With The Wind.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Misconduct »

I just watched Pearl harbor and I want my 3 hours back. I could of done more interesting things like mow the lawn.

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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by BrucePowers »

Well, we tried to tell you[:D]
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Misconduct »

ORIGINAL: BrucePowers

Well, we tried to tell you[:D]

Eh, only thing I thought of through most of the movie is "Man Kate Beckinsale is pretty darn hot, to bad she's made out to be a slut in this movie"

1940 sluts are hot. 2009 sluts like Paris Hilton make me wish I was born in 20's.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by bobogoboom »

ORIGINAL: Misconduct

ORIGINAL: BrucePowers

Well, we tried to tell you[:D]

Eh, only thing I thought of through most of the movie is "Man Kate Beckinsale is pretty darn hot, to bad she's made out to be a slut in this movie"

1940 sluts are hot. 2009 sluts like Paris Hilton make me wish I was born in 20's.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Misconduct »

I thought she slept with both guys, guess I wasn't paying attention, what guy would. She does have nice knockers.

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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by jeffk3510 »

Gosh, lot was said since I was here last night...

Got me thinking about bad war movies....

Althought it too is Hollywood, I DO like Gettysburg, BUT Tom Berenger's beard is hideous.

YH,
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by decaro »

Selected goofs for Pearl Harbor (2001) courtesy IMDB:

Factual errors: During the sequence when the bombers are taking off from the USS Hornet to bomb Japan, one cut shows a steam operated catapult. There were no catapults on the Hornet; if there were, the stripping of the bombers would not have been necessary.

Errors in geography: Mountains can be seen in the background at Mitchell Field in Long Island, which is shown as being by the sea. There are no mountains in Long Island and the base is inland.

Anachronisms: A modern barcode can be seen on the back of a whiskey bottle. There's also a clear shot of a bottle with a built-in plastic translucent pourer under a plastic screw cap.

Revealing mistakes: As the Japanese aircraft attack the smaller fields, we see the pilots and the newsreel cameraman running across the airfield. The cameraman and numerous pilots are gunned down by the Zeros twice.

Anachronisms: Air conditioning units can be seen on top of the White House.

Anachronisms: Evelyn and her nurse friends are shown wearing bikinis. The bikini didn't make its first appearance until 1946.

Anachronisms: The license plate on the car says 1943.

Incorrectly regarded as goofs: The Japanese are shown flipping a calendar from the 6th to the 7th of December on the morning of the attack. This is done for American audiences who are familiar with the date of the attack being 7 December 1941. Clocks aboard the Japanese ships were kept on Tokyo time, so for them the attack actually took place the morning of 8 December. The Japanese version of the film shows the calendar flipping from the 7th to the 8th.

Factual errors: At that time, Japanese was written from right to left. All the Japanese characters in the movie are written from left to right, except one phrase, which says, "Empire of Japan banzai".

Anachronisms: A sailor betting on Dorie Miller's boxing match has a $5 bill with the "Hawaii" overprint on it. Although series 1934 and 1934-A notes were printed with the "Hawaii" overprint, these notes were not issued until July 1942, seven months after the attack on Pearl Harbor.

Incorrectly regarded as goofs: Hardly anyone smokes. Although during the 1940s nearly every soldier smoked cigarettes, it was a conscious decision on the part of the film makers not to portray it because of the current feelings about the dangers of smoking.

Anachronisms: A modern 'rocking' style light switch can be seen in Evelyn's house.

Factual errors: The Queen Mary was painted battleship gray in 1939 and remained that way until the end of the war, serving as a troop ship for the Royal Navy.

Continuity: As Danny and Rafe try to take off from the airfield, three enemy aircraft are closing in on them, guns blazing. In the first shot, the aircraft are D3A1 "Val" dive-bombers (distinguished by their fixed landing gear in bulky fairings); in the next shot, however, the aircraft are replaced by A6M2-21 "Zero" fighters, with retractable landing gear.

Revealing mistakes: When the suspected "dud" bomb bounces across the tarmac into the oil drums, you can clearly see a webbing safety strap attached to the tip of the prop bomb as it crashes into the oil drums.

Anachronisms: When Evelyn first enters Pearl Harbor, there is a tall building that clearly says, "Est. 1953".

Anachronisms: In the first view of Pearl Harbor, just before the nurses are shown in the small transport boat the Arizona Memorial is visible in the background.

Errors in geography: Throughout the attack scene, the placement of the battleships in Battleship Row changes.
When the Oklahoma is shown capsizing, in some scenes she is correctly moored next to the Maryland, in other scenes she is next to the destroyed Arizona. In some parts the capsized ship is even surrounded by some sort of fog with no ships around her.
When Admiral Kimmel is on the small boat touring the harbor after the attack, the Oklahoma is next to the Arizona and other battleships that seem to have been placed in a random clutter next to each other, instead of the line that they were in that morning. Even in the scene showing Pearl Harbor at an aerial view right before the attack, the Geography of Ford Island and the placement of the battleships is wrong. Battleship Row isn't even visible.

Anachronisms: A Japanese officer is shown examining Reconnaissance photos mounted on black illustration board. The Name "Oxford" is clearly visible, as is the modern "Recycling" symbol, indicating that is at least partly made from recycled materials.

Anachronisms: The early boyhood scenes are dated 1923, but the father is a crop duster, an occupation that did not exist until after WWII. In addition, the Stearman biplane used in the opening scenes wasn't produced until 1934. It was a pilot trainer for the military, and was released to the public after WWII as surplus.

Factual errors: A newsreel refers to the bombing of "downtown London". While there is in fact a "central" London, this area has never been referred to as "downtown".

Anachronisms: The Japanese zero aircraft depicted in the film are green, even though the ones used in the real attack in 1941 were painted grey. The Japanese Navy didn't paint their zeroes green until 1943.

Revealing mistakes: The car the heroes drive to the airfield in is strafed by a zero. The large-caliber armor-piercing ammunition that can rip airplanes and ships to pieces does only cosmetic damage to the car.

Factual errors: Rafe wears an Eagle Squadron badge, as do the Spitfires. The squadron code 'RF' is for No.303 Squadron, which was a Polish unit. The only Hurricane seen in the film has the correct codes for an Eagle Squadron, 'XR-T' for No.71 Squadron.

Anachronisms: In the beginning of the movie, we see a newsreel of 1940, showing a US tank fighting in the city of Cologne. This did not happen before March 1945.

Factual errors: In preparation for the Doolittle raid on Japan, the film shows the Japanese medals being wired to the nose of the bombs, where they might interfere with detonation. Historic photos of the actual event show the medals being wired to the fins.

Factual errors: When the Doolittle raiders are practicing their takeoffs, the flags in the background indicate that they are on a downwind departure. Anyone with any knowledge of aviation knows you take off into the wind. Especially if you are trying to shorten the takeoff run.

Factual errors: In the movie, Rafe is assigned to an RAF Eagle Squadron prior to USA involvement in WW II by order of Jimmy Doolittle. In reality, active duty personnel could not be assigned to serve with a belligerent nation while the US was neutral. They would have to resign their USAAF commission and re-enlist into the RAF (usually via Canada). This practice was greatly discouraged.

Factual errors: After Pearl Harbor, Col Doolittle recruited Rafe and Danny to fly on the Raid on Tokyo. Rafe and Danny are single-engined fighter pilots and would not be qualified to fly multi-engined bombers.
While the B-25 Mitchell bomber is an easy plane to fly, the participants would have come from qualified bombardment squadrons. As a matter of historical record, the pilots on the actual raid largely were recruited from the 34th Bombardment Squadron of the 17th Bombardment Group (aka, "The Thunderbirds").

Anachronisms: In the golf course scene you can see a Willys Jeep M38. This car was not produced before 1950.

Factual errors: During the Doolittle Raid, there is a shot of the planes flying toward the camera with the setting sun behind them. During the actual mission, the planes flew west to Japan, then continued west to China, into the setting sun, not away from it.

Anachronisms: In the England scene, a spitfire with a four-blade propeller is seen. This was a late-war model. All Spitfires at the time of the Battle of Britain were models with three-blade constant pitch propellers.

Continuity: While the Japanese flagship, the carrier IJN Akagi, is normally shown as an accurate representation of the WWII vessel, in one long shot of the Japanese fleet she is instead represented by a modern nuclear-powered supercarrier which looks completely different. In later shots, the accurate Akagi is shown again.

Factual errors: The Japenese torpedo dropped from a plane rockets on the water with its wooden frame intact. In reality, the wooden frame would detach once in the water.

Factual errors: Danny's B-25 strafes the Japanese forces that are advancing on Rafe's position after he ditches, firing the fuselage-mounted 50-caliber machine guns. The B-25B models used in the raid were not outfitted with these guns.

Miscellaneous: All of the ships shown in the attack sequence have their Naval (bow) registry numbers painted over with an off color hue on the hull. Also they have radar and antennas that do not belong on ships supposedly constructed prior to 1941.

Factual errors: Rafe explains to the pilots, that are going to fight the Zeros that are strafing the airfield, that "P-40's can't outrun Zeros, so we're going to have to out-fly them."
He has the aircraft capabilities backwards. In level flight and especially a dive, the P-40 can outrun a Zero any day. On the same note, a Zero can fly circles around a P-40. Pilots fighting the Zero in the P-40 were told to use "zoom and boom" tactics, diving on Zeros and racing away. If a P-40 pilot ever tried to out-fly a Zeros superior maneuverability, he'd be dead.

Anachronisms: The rimless eyeglasses worn by Dan Aykroyd's character, with the lenses held in place by a nylon wire, are a relatively modern invention. Back in WWII, the only rimless eyeglasses that would have been available were what were called "drill-mounts"; holes were drilled into the lenses, and the nose bridge and temples were screwed into the lenses via these drill holes. Nylon wire rimless glasses didn't come into use until many years later.

Anachronisms: As soon as the Japanese planes fly in, we see shots of the US fleet. The ships with the overhanging ladder style device at their bows are a class of assault-transport ship that were not launched until the early 1970s - some 30 years after the events takes place.

Factual errors: Only one raider died during a plane crash following the Doolittle Raid. Two others died from their injuries sustained from crashes. Five more died while in Japanese captivity (4 executed; 1 of malnutrition). However, the movie killed off several raiders inaccurately, including one from Japanese anti-artillery fire during the actual raid.

Anachronisms: A speedboat featured is a 1950's era Capri type Chris Craft. The movie is set in 1941.

Revealing mistakes: During the Doolittle raid take off scene, a shot from the nose of a B25 clearly shows the launching mechanism that was on the deck of a modern aircraft carrier, used for launching jet fighters.

Factual errors: Military Nurses were not permitted to wear long flowing hair styles as portrayed in the film. While in uniform, including their whites, the length permitted was just above their collars.

Factual errors: The Doolittle raid is loaded with errors. First, the 16 bombers are shown flying together at somewhat high altitude and in formation on the way to Japan, whereas each plane actually flew the mission as a single sortie at very low altitude to avoid radar detection.
Next, the Japanese targets are shown to suffer very heavy bombing damage, whereas very little damage was actually done (the psychological damage to the Japanese, however, was considerable).
Finally, Japanese land and air defense forces are shown to offer heavy resistance to the American bombers during the attack, whereas the bombers were not detected before the attack and were unopposed during the attack.

Factual errors: During the Japanese attack, one of their bombers that are attacking an airfield is carrying an aerial torpedo. This weapon is designed only to attack ships by being launched at low level into the water by a bomber flying toward the target, not to attack land-based targets.

Factual errors: In the several scenes showing the large Japanese fleet formation prior to the attack, the ships are so close together as to constitute an extremely serious hazard underway. Actual ship-to-ship spacing in a large carrier task force is typically 200 to 500 yards, in which case the entire task force could not be shown, even on the widest screen available, unless photographed from a much higher altitude than as portrayed.

Factual errors: Doris Miller is shown as a petty officer second class. Miller was in fact a petty officer third class at the time of the Pearl Harbor attack.

Factual errors: When Pearl Harbor is attacked, Danny says that World War II just began, but World War I was then known as The Great War.

Anachronisms: After the attack on Pearl Harbor, Danny and Rafe are seen boarding a C-47 transport which is to take them to their destination where they will train for the top secret mission. The C-47 used, clearly has a radar dome mounted in the nose. C-47s of this type did not exist in that time frame.

Factual errors: Evelyn and other nurses are seen being decorated with the Purple Heart. Evelyn was not wounded in the movie; the Purple Heart is only awarded to those who have been wounded or killed.

Factual errors: During the practice runs for the Doolittle raid, the B25s are heard to squeal their tires and fishtail under the heavy throttle at takeoff. As all airplanes are prop or jet powered, not wheel powered, this would be impossible.

Factual errors: Admiral Yamamoto did not exercise operational over the Pearl Harbor attack and therefore did not cancel the third wave. Decision was made by Vice-Admiral Nagumo who was the actual commander of the Japanese carrier force.

Anachronisms: Japanese pilots are shown putting on white rising star headbands and drinking a cup of sake before the takeoff. This ritual was created for the kamikaze units and appeared almost three years later.

And I omitted most of minor continuity errors.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by jeffk3510 »

I have seen this before... such a long list...[:D]
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by BrucePowers »

Which is why I have never bothered to see the movie[:D]
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by Local Yokel »

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

Anachronisms: Japanese pilots are shown putting on white rising star headbands and drinking a cup of sake before the takeoff. This ritual was created for the kamikaze units and appeared almost three years later.

In his own account of the attack Fuchida records that the CPO in charge of his maintenance crew handed him a hachimaki with the request that he wear it during the attack. Fuchida states that he agreed to do so. This scene appears in Tora! Tora! Tora! and it's quite possible that this did, in fact, occur. Although Fuchida's credibility has been shot to pieces somewhat, perhaps this is a detail that he recounted accurately.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by decaro »

ORIGINAL: Local Yokel
ORIGINAL: Joe D.
Anachronisms: Japanese pilots are shown putting on white rising star headbands and drinking a cup of sake before the takeoff. This ritual was created for the kamikaze units and appeared almost three years later.

In his own account of the attack Fuchida records that the CPO in charge of his maintenance crew handed him a hachimaki with the request that he wear it during the attack. Fuchida states that he agreed to do so. This scene appears in Tora! Tora! Tora! and it's quite possible that this did, in fact, occur. Although Fuchida's credibility has been shot to pieces somewhat, perhaps this is a detail that he recounted accurately.

Wasn't this the same IJN officer who gave us the "flight decks filled w/aircraft ready to launch" story? But actual photos revealed the only aircraft on the IJN carriers at that time were Zeroes refueling for CAP duty.

Fuchida's credibility has been so shot to hell that I wouldn't accept anything he said on face value.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by gladiatt »

ORIGINAL: Bobthehatchit


I’d rather watch Battle of the Bulge, than the film that shall not be mentioned!


Battke of the Bulge is awful. Not a real wwII tank. Not a real character name for the story (same with "Battle of Britain"). Not a single battle scene wich can be feel as "true". Even Henri Fonda was not great....I'd prefer to see Pea....errr "the movie that shall not be named", because of Kate........
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by steveh11Matrix »

ORIGINAL: gladiatt

ORIGINAL: Bobthehatchit


I’d rather watch Battle of the Bulge, than the film that shall not be mentioned!


Battke of the Bulge is awful. Not a real wwII tank. Not a real character name for the story (same with "Battle of Britain"). Not a single battle scene wich can be feel as "true". Even Henri Fonda was not great....I'd prefer to see Pea....errr "the movie that shall not be named", because of Kate........
Er... "Battle of Briatain" had real characters in it: Dowding, Churchill, Park, Molders, Galland, Goering for a start. And at least they had real aircraft - unlike both of the other films mentioned. BoB wasn't a bad, film, considering.

Of course, everyone here knows that "TMTSNBN" was rubbish and would prefer to see "Tora! Tora! Tora!".

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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by gladiatt »

ORIGINAL: steveh11Matrix

ORIGINAL: gladiatt

ORIGINAL: Bobthehatchit


I’d rather watch Battle of the Bulge, than the film that shall not be mentioned!


Battke of the Bulge is awful. Not a real wwII tank. Not a real character name for the story (same with "Battle of Britain"). Not a single battle scene wich can be feel as "true". Even Henri Fonda was not great....I'd prefer to see Pea....errr "the movie that shall not be named", because of Kate........
Er... "Battle of Briatain" had real characters in it: Dowding, Churchill, Park, Molders, Galland, Goering for a start. And at least they had real aircraft - unlike both of the other films mentioned. BoB wasn't a bad, film, considering.

Of course, everyone here knows that "TMTSNBN" was rubbish and would prefer to see "Tora! Tora! Tora!".

Steve.

About "Battle of Britain" of course great character are historicaly accurate: Churchill, Park, Dowding, Goering. But i am not sure pilots (even stars like Douglas Bader and Galland) had their correct name. I mean, maybe it's because of a the "translation" in others language. Or their was a political will to make it a fiction??? But i'm pretty sure that names were screwed in the french version...At the least, most plane looked like what they should be, and many anectodtes were correctly shown.
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RE: You have got to be kidding me.

Post by bobogoboom »

ORIGINAL: steveh11Matrix

ORIGINAL: gladiatt

ORIGINAL: Bobthehatchit


I’d rather watch Battle of the Bulge, than the film that shall not be mentioned!


Battke of the Bulge is awful. Not a real wwII tank. Not a real character name for the story (same with "Battle of Britain"). Not a single battle scene wich can be feel as "true". Even Henri Fonda was not great....I'd prefer to see Pea....errr "the movie that shall not be named", because of Kate........
Er... "Battle of Briatain" had real characters in it: Dowding, Churchill, Park, Molders, Galland, Goering for a start. And at least they had real aircraft - unlike both of the other films mentioned. BoB wasn't a bad, film, considering.

Of course, everyone here knows that "TMTSNBN" was rubbish and would prefer to see "Tora! Tora! Tora!".

Steve.
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