Close Assault - how is it done?

[WhiteOwl]

Reading the manual it mentions that there is a special attack mode for close assaulting vehicles when under 25m range. Is this an explicit command or is it triggered automatically when infantry is less than 25m away?

I am trying to get through mission #4 in the boot camp campaign with little success. How do you get the infantry to assault the tanks when they are close in to the houses? In CM there was the Assault command, would Engage->Move be the equivelant in PC?

[Stridor]

There is a hold fire close assault command.

If you do an normal attack < 25 m against an armoured vehicle, you automatically do a close assault. It would be nice if the infantry squad changed to do a grenade throw animation to reinforce that a close assault is taking place, but they just fire their rifles as normal [:(]

In order to complete the 4th mission you need to get your timing right. You have to learn when to break cover and rush the target. Also try and rush all of your squads at once. You will overwhelm the T34s. Close assault against the rear of the tank if possible as that is the weakest point.

#4 is a tough mission but once you learn the timings it is not so bad. You will probably lose one or two squads, but that is the price you pay. There are many times in the campaigns which are to follow (an especially the random campaigns) in which you will need to learn close assault skills to stop enemy vehicles.

Enjoy

[Erik Rutins]

As Stridor said, infantry will automatically switch to Close Assault rules when within 25m of a vehicle. You just need to get them there. Defend -> Close Assault is useful because it makes sure they hold their fire (and thus generally remain unspotted if they are in good cover like a building or forest) until they are in range to give it a try.

If you check p.59 in the manual, you will see the Close Assault modifiers. In short, ideally you want an unsuppressed squad with no casualties close assaulting a non-moving enemy vehicle from the side or rear. Keep in mind that non-moving vehicles only "spot" to their front 180 degrees, the rest is a blind-spot. Moving vehicles only "spot" to their front 90 degrees. You can really use that to your advantage in setting up a close assault.

[Mobius]

ORIGINAL: WhiteOwl
How do you get the infantry to assault the tanks when they are close in to the houses? In CM there was the Assault command, would Engage->Move be the equivelant in PC?

No. Engage Order just allows some of the platoon units to fire at targets you select and others to move around a bit. To fire it cannot move. If a unit moves it won't be able to fire until it stops. If you do not give a stopped Engage ordered unit a target the AI will choose one for you just like a Defend>Stay order.

Most everything requires the units to be at a stop to fire except Advance, Advancing units do fire while moving but they move (about 20-25%) slower than other movement rates.

[WhiteOwl]

So, based on all the above, which command would be best to use for the anti-tank mission (#4 in boot camp)? Would it be rush to get into a close firing position as soon as possible (but at the cost of perhaps "losing" the contact)? assualt to be able to fire (at the cost of slow motion, and useless firing until under 25m)? or maybe regular motion, i.e. target->move to choose middle ground?

Anyway, I'm should get back to overcoming that mission...

Cheers

[Erik Rutins]

If you find yourself with a decent amount of ground to cover, I would use Rush. If the vehicle is almost within Close Assault range already, then Advance or orders like Defend -> Move would be fine to cover the last 10-15 meters. You also have to judge the vehicle's speed and where it's going. Ideally, you want to make sure you end up close enough to close assault it while coming in from its side or rear where it can't see you - sometimes that requires the speed of a Rush move. As soon as you get close enough, you can switch to Target in the reaction phase and have at it.

[Mobius]

ORIGINAL: WhiteOwl
So, based on all the above, which command would be best to use for the anti-tank mission (#4 in boot camp)? Would it be rush to get into a close firing position as soon as possible (but at the cost of perhaps "losing" the contact)? assualt to be able to fire (at the cost of slow motion, and useless firing until under 25m)? or maybe regular motion, i.e. target->move to choose middle ground?
Anyway, I'm should get back to overcoming that mission...
Cheers

Yes, and it depends. Rush until they are within 25mm.
Unless - the squads only need to move 25 or less additional meters to get within that range. Then Defend move them the last leg. That is because while Rushing they have a +1 to being harmed by gunfire as compared to the slower Defend movement.

And don't forget your men have smoke grenades too. You might want to make some smoke to rush behind. Though waiting for the smoke cloud to build delays your attack.

[Grell]

Hi WhiteOwl,

Is this game ridiculously complex or am I just reading too much into it?

Regards,

Grell

[Erik Rutins]

ORIGINAL: Grell
Is this game ridiculously complex or am I just reading too much into it?

It probably sounds that way if you haven't played it. When we're discussing how to eke out little advantages from one maneuver or another, it's getting into advanced gameplay which can be a bit technical in any tactical game. How to move somewhere and shoot something is actually quite simple in and of itself.

[Erik Rutins]

Whiteowl,

I just replayed Mission #4 and here's what I did. I set each of my squads to Defend -> Close Assault on Turn 1. I then waited until the T-34s got across the bridge and into town. One of them drove near one of my squads in the buildings and that squad started a close assault which immobilized the T-34. Since he was already engaging the enemy, I unmounted my two squads on the other side of the street and sent them to the T-34's other side with Engage -> Move orders. One squad took casualties and was suppressed by the second T-34, the other got to position and between the two they took out the first T-34.

The second T-34 was then focused on my remaining squads. While it was occupied with those, I unmounted my second platoon and Rushed them to positions that surrounded the T-34, then switched to Defend. I lost another squad from the first platoon during this and the T-34 was keeping that platoon pretty well suppressed, but the second platoon's arrival destroyed it in a phase with a combined close assault from several angles.

Regards,

- Erik

[WhiteOwl]

ORIGINAL: Grell

Hi WhiteOwl,

Is this game ridiculously complex or am I just reading too much into it?

Regards,

Grell

Hi Grell, please don't read too much into my ineptitude It isn't really that hard, I am able to finish the missions, and am in fact up to mission #6 after playing all of the two-three hours I was able to squeeze in this weekend. The boot camp missions seem to purposefully place you in certain difficult situations that require you to learn a specific skill in order to "solve" them. As such, they are a bit of puzzle missions, where solving the puzzle teaches you a skill.

Now, generally, puzzle missions are not good, because you should be able to apply general tactics to a problem and solve it. However, for the purpose of the boot camp campaign, i.e. teaching you specific skills, I find them quite useful and interesting. In fact, after mastering a skill required to finish a mission, I am then able to repeatedly finish the missions, and not because I know the enemy placement, but because I know the required skill. If you've ever played CM, and done JasonC's set of missions (infantry 101 where you advanced a green sov platoon across open ground against an MG42), you'll recognise the idea.

All in all, I am enjoying this game tremendously, and at least on easy, it is not very hard (as you would expect ). If you're sitting on the fence even partially because my posts give the impression that this is too unrealisticly hard, I would say get off the fence and you won't regret it!

Cheers

[WhiteOwl]

Hi Erik,

I was able to complete the mission. In fact after I understood that I only need to get my squads to the <25m range it was quite easy. As you suggested, I rushed when far and target->moved when close and managed to kill both tanks with any loss (not even a step). Another thing I learned from this mission is how to umnount my leader, issue a rush so I can rush other squads who were far from the enemy, then remount the leader back to the house he was in, around 20m from the tank.

Thanks very much for your help so far, but unfortunately for you I still have 3 missions to go, so you can expect more questions. But seriously, I am extremely impressed with both seeing a dev who plays and knows his game (at a player's level, not designer), and also with the dedication and very good attitude you are displaying in supporting this release. You always seem to be online, and this is Australia I am writing from So all in all, you've more than earned the measly 70 AUD I paid for this game, not to mention how much fun it is.

Cheers

[Grell]

Hi Erik and WhiteOwl,

Thanks for straitening me out.

Regards,

Grell

[desert dawg]

Ok, I keep trying Boot Camp #4 and I'm unable to pass it on easy. I keep trying to let the T34's pass my first positions. They see the squad in the second house on their right, they stop and shoot them to death. The panzers are not quite into the town yet, so dismounting my other 2 squads would require me to run at their front and then past to their sides. This is likely going to them mowed down. After they kill the squad in the building they move up and one stops within 25 meters of the squad in the first house on their left. I dismount this squad and the squad from the first house on the right as you enter the town. I rush the back of the exposed tank . The squad closest to the rear of the tank fires into the rear of the tank at about 15 meters,but eventually dies and the squad across the street gets mowed down as he crosses the street. At this time I usually get a Legendary Loss. However, in a couple of tries I've gotten the squads closest to the victory flags out and rushed the tank closest to the victory flag to that tanks rear or side. They get mowed down without taking out more than a tank tread. What am I doing wrong. If I can't pass this on easy I don't stand a chance in the rest of the game.

[Mobius]

Throw out some smoke. Timing as the T-34s cross the bridge.
Also, try to get all your infantry to go at once.  So if they are spotted throw them all against the T-34s not piecemeal. 

[rickier65]

ORIGINAL: desert dawg

Ok, I keep trying Boot Camp #4 and I'm unable to pass it on easy. I keep trying to let the T34's pass my first positions. They see the squad in the second house on their right, they stop and shoot them to death. The panzers are not quite into the town yet, so dismounting my other 2 squads would require me to run at their front and then past to their sides. This is likely going to them mowed down. After they kill the squad in the building they move up and one stops within 25 meters of the squad in the first house on their left. I dismount this squad and the squad from the first house on the right as you enter the town. I rush the back of the exposed tank . The squad closest to the rear of the tank fires into the rear of the tank at about 15 meters,but eventually dies and the squad across the street gets mowed down as he crosses the street. At this time I usually get a Legendary Loss. However, in a couple of tries I've gotten the squads closest to the victory flags out and rushed the tank closest to the victory flag to that tanks rear or side. They get mowed down without taking out more than a tank tread. What am I doing wrong. If I can't pass this on easy I don't stand a chance in the rest of the game.

You can also use area fire *close* to the Russain Tanks from your farthest Infantry unit. you can get lucky and force the T34's to button-up, then they wont be as likely to see your closer Infantry.

You can't actually target the T34's with Infantry, but you can use area fire 'close' to them.

Rick

[Mobius]

Good idea Rick, I forgot about your tactic.&nbsp;&nbsp;Place the target&nbsp;point next to the tank so the &nbsp;blue area fire box&nbsp;goes on the tank.