Use AI editor for a much better game

Advanced Tactics is a versatile turn-based strategy system that gives gamers the chance to wage almost any battle in any time period. The initial release focuses on World War II and includes a number of historical scenarios as well as a full editor! This forum supports both the original Advanced Tactics and the new and improved Advanced Tactics: Gold Edition.

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miral
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Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by miral »

This is written by someone who is an utter clutz with computers, so if I can do it, anyone can. There is always discussion about how good the AI of a game is, how stupid it is, ect. Please look at Vic's thread in the Support Forum on AI 101. You can get a much better game by editing the AI and it is very easy to do and there are many, many ways to make it better. Tired of Ai leaving planes undefended near the front? Easy to edit to have it defend better. I personally don't like the Ai spawning hundreds of very weak divisions. It is just as easy to set the Ai to produce fewer, larger divisions. You can even set the percentage of suport weapons (mortars, mgs, ect.) to infantry you want. The defautl AI tries to set up a continuous front, which probably leads to all the weak units. This is both irritating and ahistorical. You can edit it so the AI will try and defend a percentage of front; that is, you could have it try and cover 75% of front, leaving it more units to hold in reserve. You can set naval strategy and even the composition of fleets. There are several dozen settings that allow you to easily customize your game far beyond the basic amounts of land. You can set agression levels of the AI nations, what size cities they will defend, whether they will try primarily to take your cities or destroy your units. It is a wonderful aid to play.
Warspite3
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by Warspite3 »

Great to know this! I might try to play around with it, but the AI puts up a good fight against me on default. It would be interesting if others would upload their custom AIs and we can play against it. It nearly opens a whole new world to AT when you think about it. I have a couple of scenarios I created and even though the AI fights them good, I may try to customize a little of the AI for it.
-Warspite3-
Ande
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by Ande »

what about having two costum AIs fight eachother? Battle of AI programming
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siRkid
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by siRkid »

ORIGINAL: Ande

what about having two costum AIs fight eachother? Battle of AI programming

I think you might have someting there. It might lead to an outstanding AI in the end.
Former War in the Pacific Test Team Manager and Beta Tester for War in the East.

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PDiFolco
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by PDiFolco »

First thing should be that people succeeding in improving the AI share their experience/files...

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miral
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by miral »

Warspite3, I agree that the AI puts up a good fight without change. But then I'm not one of those who try to find every flaw in the AI, remember it and use it every time. Or, you could say I'm not a real great player. Depends how you look at it.

It takes maybe 2-4 minutes to customize the AI for a random game. Oh, and you can customize the AI for scenarios too, just found that out. There are several dozen things you can set but the ones I find most useful are, as mentioned, making larger enemy units; not having the AI try and cover 100% of the front, increasing the number of aircraft the AI produce and, I find most important, setting the AI to try and kill your units rather than be more concerned with taking your cities. After all, if they kill enough of your units the cities will fall. And be sure and set the AI to mobilize as much of their forces each time as possible. I have not tried changing the compositions of the navies much because I can't get the ships to move faster than the default and this is just too slow so I usually play on maps with little water.

I love the WWII scenarios and have started to customize the AI. This makes for a far better game. Rarely play the Nazis but, if you do, I think it is very important to set the Russians to not try and cover 100% of the front or you will get a swarm of midget Russian units. Just a suggestion; you could argue that this is what the Russians actually did.

After you have started to beat the default AI try customizing it and you will get a much better opponent.
PDiFolco
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by PDiFolco »

miral
Could you give some specifics on variables and values you've tweaked and to which effect ?
Sure everyone can experience and test by himself, but not everyone has the time or inclination to do it.
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miral
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by miral »

PDiFolco, I will mention the ones I think are most important and have best effect on game (as I said, there are several dozen). Please remember I don't have game in front of me so this is from memory.

First, the front setting. I don't think it makes sense to have the AI try to cover 100% of front. This makes for tactical and operational rigidity; the AI may pass up chances to may good attacks because it doesn't want to leave a gap in the front. You can easily set the front coverage to any percentage. I have used 60-75% and found that the AI attacks more and generally manuevers with greater fluidity.

Unit size. The default setting does two things that make for a weak AI army; small units and units composed of only 2 or 3 kinds of weapon systems. You can set a minimum stacking points level for the Ai to build units to. I usually set it to 200-300 (default is 100) and the Ai produces large powerful units that give me a run for the money. You can set whether you want the AI to include more SFtypes in each unit. The higher or lower (forget which) you set the number the greater kinds and numbers of SFtypes will be included in AI units. I find this particularly good for producing powerful AI units as combined arms, integrating weapon systems, is the essense of success in 20th century warfare. The Germans were unexcelled at this (though they were hopeless at strategy).
You can also set the upward size of Ai units so you dont get some monstrous aberation with 3000 inf in it.

I forget what its called but there is an edit function that allows the AI to create more HQ than it normally would based on unit distance from HQS. I use this as I find the AI on default does not create enough HQs to get the HW power bonus.

ONe of the most important settings is to direct the AI to try and destroy your units more that to try and take your cities. Many times on default I've had units attacked, reduced, and in danger of elimination and the AI has turned aside to try and take cities. The enemy army should usually be the main target, then the cities will fall. I use this one and find the AI will attack the same one of my units repeatedly unil it is destroyed. This eliminates my veteran unit, opens a gap in my lines and forces me to spend a PP to produce a new unit.

Another important setting is the percentage of units the AI will try and mobilize each turn, which can be broken down into artillery, armor and other. I set this higher than the default and see many more attacks on me. I set it higher for defense also.

Am running out of time as I dont have my own internet access and have limited access to it.

Some more minor but useful settings will provide troop protection to AI air units and garrison cities behind AI lines to a depth you set. No more sneaking a fast unit behind enemy lines to destroy a whole bunch of unguarded aircraft. Same with Artillery; you can have more troops protect it. You can also set the percentage of infantry you want with armor. I have used all these setting and find that, cumulatively, they greatly strengthen the AI. I double or triple the default settings for troops protecting aircraft and artillery and guarding cities. I also always change the default that has the AI only try and protect its own city if that city produces 10,000 points.

Havent tried the naval settings yet. Oh yes, I always set the Ai to produce many more air units than the default and find this increases the AI power greatly. Also, you can have the AI produce more PP than the default, to simulate fighting an enemy with a greater industrial strength.

A combination of some or all of these changed settings (and there is a wide range of latitudes for most of the settings; a few only have 2 or 3 choices) will make the AI produce more powerful units, fight them better, and guard its assets better.

I will experient more over the next week and try to put up some other edit functions that make for a better AI game. And, again, these are very easy to change, else I couldn't do it.

miral
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by miral »

Sorry, I see I didn't give as many specific numbers for settings as I should have.  Will try and do so next time. Thanks.
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Magpius
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by Magpius »

Excellent work here Miral.
For someone who professes to being computer illiterate, you are doing a bang up job tweaking the A.I.
-inspiring
Warspite3
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by Warspite3 »

I agree! [:)]
ORIGINAL: Agent S

Excellent work here Miral.
For someone who professes to being computer illiterate, you are doing a bang up job tweaking the A.I.
-inspiring
-Warspite3-
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montarakid
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by montarakid »

Sounds like some seriously good information here.

Question. Does one have to make these AI adjustments at the start of each game, or is there a way to address the settings as a default for all games?
"If brute force doesn't work, you aren't using enough brute force." - mTk
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Magpius
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by Magpius »

You could alter the generic masterfile.
Make a backup copy before you start tinkering!
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ravinhood
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by ravinhood »

Having AI's fight other AI's is exactly what they did with the KOHAN II series. Since they gave us AI templates to work with in Kohan. I didn't find out about it until it was over though. lol My AI came in like 18th, but, when I checked the PRIMARY AI that I created it for Ravinhood101 Nightmare edition didn't lose a single battle. It was my Drauga AI that lost and it was just a 2ndary one I was programming when I stopped and wasn't finished at all. lol It all got started when I introduced my AI as one that could beat someone else's ai that was on the board bragging about it all the time. lol Sooooooo, I created one that would beat his over n over n over again. I even have FILM of one battle that he was waaaay ahead of me and my AI came back from 3 to 1 odds and beat his. lol Man if yall start having AI wars with this I'll have to get my own copy and beat your AI's haha. Then we could share our say top 10 AI files with everyone providing we had some place to upload them so people could download them. I really like games where I can muck with the AI instead of the stats.
WE/I WANT 1:1 or something even 1:2 death animations in the KOIOS PANZER COMMAND SERIES don't forget Erik! ;) and Floating Paratroopers We grew up with Minor, Marginal and Decisive victories why rock the boat with Marginal, Decisive and Legendary?


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bssybeep
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by bssybeep »

Where is this "editing the AI 101" tutorial?  I search the whole AT forum and looked through every page of the support forum.  Any help appreciated.
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LarryP
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by LarryP »

ORIGINAL: miral

Please look at Vic's thread in the Support Forum on AI 101.

Where is this thread? I can't find it. [&:] [:)]
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bssybeep
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by bssybeep »

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LarryP
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by LarryP »

ORIGINAL: bssybeep

Found it, look here: http://www.advancedtactics.org/documents.php

Thank you so much! And so quick too. Bless you. [&o][&o][&o] I was looking all over and never found it.

After going to the page above, I am amazed at all the information Vic has given us for this game. This is truly an amazing game! It seems to be limitless. A ton of work for one guy. [:)] [&o]
Ande
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by Ande »

only problem with AIbattles is that there is just possible to have one ai(type) per scenario
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bssybeep
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RE: Use AI editor for a much better game

Post by bssybeep »

Glad to help[:)]
This is one of my favorite games.  I just spent some time doing some ai editing and started another huge ramdon map.  Fun stuff!  I'm hoping for some non-WWII units and technologies to be created in the near future to use with the random map generator.
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