Best ASW Tactic for JAPAN

[Coach Z]

I have seen conflicting postings.
What is the best way to spot those pesky Allied Subs?

Combat Aircraft on ASW Patrol at 1000/2000 ft?
or RECON planes on Naval Search @ 3000 to 6000 ft?
or is it a combination of both.... with of course vigorous ASW Patrols?

[Mike Solli]

I've found that Naval Search at 1-5000' works wonders.  I tried it in Feb 43 in a PBEM and sank 10 Allied subs that month, primarily to air power.

[Terminus]

Best ASW tactic for Japan?

Stay in port!


===

Sorry... The key is smothering the enemy; Jap ASW isn't good enough to do pinpoint stuff, so overloading is key. Use a combo of ASW patrol and Naval Search at low altitude (1,000-2,000 feet).

[wernerpruckner]

the Japanese APDs are a deadly weapon in anti submarine warfare

Most important are probably many patrol and bomber A/C on either ASW patrol or naval search. If they find something and damage it - or the Allied player is too lazy to move his subs around - send in a ASW surface group.
There are a few quite good Japanese ASW ships.

[Mike Solli]

I should add that I use bombers (and recon, of course) on naval search.  The Sallys and Helens drop nice 250 kg bombs on the subs.  That's a killer.

[RUPD3658]

I found that once the ASW ships are trained to 50-60 exp it sometimes works best to put a ton of escorts on a super convoy. I got a lot of kills this way in mid-late 43. It seemed like I got more attacks this way than with ASW TFs

[KPAX]

Some great advise.  A few items I have learned.
 
1.  You do not see them, you do not hit them.  Use all those junk homeland patrols on Naval Search.  They tend to do a decent job of spotting them.  Once again, if you do not see them, you ain't going to hit them.
 
2.  Set up ASW TF, can even be with the crap MSW ships and have them run back and forth across a problem area.  Say, one stationed in Hong Kong to Bataan and vice versa.  One ASW TF stationed in HK and the other in Bataan and run them back and forth.  Same thing for the home Island ports.  Just run them bacn and forth.
 
3.  If you have the super convoy load the TF with ASWs but also build a ASW TF or two that follows the super convoy.  That way the ASW TF can get the bonus for being in a ASW TF.
 
4.  If you make an ASW TF make sure that if has a DD in it which has radar.  Most of the PGs, MSWs, etc do not have radar.  You only need a single DD with radar to provide that for the whole TF.  This is very applicable for the Allies from about Oct 42 and after.  I will make an Allied ASW with MSWs, etc and insure that a DD with radar is in the group.  Helps a ton.
 
Hope that helps.

[scout1]

Come on Rick,

The best defense is a good offense ..... As a Notre Dame fan, you should appreciate that .... Try to keep ones own defense off the field .... [:D]

[KPAX]

Scotty,
 
Righto, terrible advise.  [:'(]
 
Forget about the USN subs, they have crap torpedoes anyways !! 
 
Sail full steam ahead !  [;)]

[MineSweeper]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

I should add that I use bombers (and recon, of course) on naval search.  The Sallys and Helens drop nice 250 kg bombs on the subs.  That's a killer.

Yep, they are excellent for anti-sub work.....get them trained to 80-90 exp and they are very potent.....
I once had a Japanese ASW TF destroyer launch a torpedo at a surfaced American sub....it missed and I was not fast enough to get a screen shot....anybody seen that happen before?

[Gem35]

I like T's advice the best.[;)]

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: MineSweeper

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

I should add that I use bombers (and recon, of course) on naval search.  The Sallys and Helens drop nice 250 kg bombs on the subs.  That's a killer.

Yep, they are excellent for anti-sub work.....get them trained to 80-90 exp and they are very potent.....
I once had a Japanese ASW TF destroyer launch a torpedo at a surfaced American sub....it missed and I was not fast enough to get a screen shot....anybody seen that happen before?

Yup:

[MineSweeper]

Cool.....I thought it was a freak occurance....I have only seen it once....Though I have seen the ASW destroyers shell surfaced subs a number of times.[;)]

PS - I have always wondered what determines a sub to be surfaced when attacked by an ASW TF....super duper roll lucky ASW unit?

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Best ASW tactic for Japan?

Stay in port!

That was going to be my answer.

[niceguy2005]

Best method I have seen is lots of planes on nav search and DDs in an ASW group. If I were Japan I would form up several highly skilled ASW ships and station them at problem areas. Let your air recon do the spotting and then run your fast DDs there to attack. As an allied player I got a lot of I-boat kills this way.

Japan should save its MSW, PC and PG for convoy escort where you only want to keep those pesky subs heads down, you don't need to kill them.

[Mike Solli]

Niceguy, I agree with you suggestions about how the Japanese should conduct ASW ops.  The only problem with that is that there are limited DDs in the game (as was the case historically).  They were needed for combat ops and escorts for air TFs.  I find that (with occasional exceptions) it's rare to have many DDs available for ASW ops.  That ends up falling to the PGs, PCs and MSWs.

[MineSweeper]

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

Best method I have seen is lots of planes on nav search and DDs in an ASW group. If I were Japan I would form up several highly skilled ASW ships and station them at problem areas. Let your air recon do the spotting and then run your fast DDs there to attack. As an allied player I got a lot of I-boat kills this way.

Japan should save its MSW, PC and PG for convoy escort where you only want to keep those pesky subs heads down, you don't need to kill them.

No need to save MSWs, they Re-Re-Re-Re - Spawnnnnnnnnn (not my favorite word)[:D]

IMO, I think that PCs are more effective then the overtaxed DDs for ASW work....

[Mike Solli]

You'll need every MSW you can lay your hands on when the Allied player can start laying aerial mines (you know, those stealth planes that can't be intercepted by CAP).

[MineSweeper]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

You'll need every MSW you can lay your hands on when the Allied player can start laying aerial mines (you know, those stealth planes that can't be intercepted by CAP).

Yep, you will need them for that.....I don't use MS's often for ASW (to slow, not enough DC racks and short range).....I do like the Japanese APDs early in the game, but are a major target for US subs[:@]

[niceguy2005]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Niceguy, I agree with you suggestions about how the Japanese should conduct ASW ops.  The only problem with that is that there are limited DDs in the game (as was the case historically).  They were needed for combat ops and escorts for air TFs.  I find that (with occasional exceptions) it's rare to have many DDs available for ASW ops.  That ends up falling to the PGs, PCs and MSWs.

I haven't played Japan in a large campaign before, so I don't know much about DD availability, only as you say that theren't aren't a lot to go around. That said, I would still highly recommend a Japan player to do what he can to create at least some DD ASW groups, along with APDs (also very good).

I find MSW and PCs mostly to be just additional targets for allied subs. I have been sinking these ships in droves in one of my games...sometimes several a turn.

I'm not suggesting that Japan not use patrol ships for ASW, just that at critical areas they have some DDs on ASW.