Look at this screenshot taken from a Human (Allies) against Computer (Japanese).
It is possible to invade Japan but capturing Tokyo is another thing. There are over 100,000 of troops in Tokyo! I only have about a quarter of that on Honshu. The second turn in Tokyo I encountered a Japanese shock attack and everybody retreated. The Computer is not exactly stupid either, it has moved some troops (30000+/- worth) out of Tokyo to Shimizu and Gummi (?? that base just north of Tokyo) and forced me back to defensive mode rather quickly. Osaka is probably the second toughest compare to Tokyo.
Auto-Convoy will work for Hokkaido and Shikoku, not for Honshu. I'll have to bring in my own Transport missions to sustain my operation there. Tori Shima serves me well as a forward operation base for surface combat task forces. Just park one of those task forces in front of Tokyo bay and nothing can move out of it.
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H. Lo
Previously played:
Uncommon Valor
War In The Pacific: AE
War Plan Orange
Steel Panthers series
Couple game months later, the Japanese AI have started to counterattacks. Some troops have ventured out of Tokyo and attack the Allies forces nearby, not substantial but definitely force me into a encirclement mode. There are some Surface Combat task groups roaming outside Tokyo and Tori Shima as well causing some headaches to my Transports. However I am sending in regular Surface Combat task groups into the Tokyo hex which sink about 8 ships a day.
Here are my curiousities:
1. Will Tokyo ever run out of gas and supplies?
2. If I somehow manage to sink all the merchant ships in Tokyo, what will happen to the Japanese supply system?
3. I have attacked Osaka before but the defensive forces of Engineers and Coastal Guns have been very effective in holding me back. Will Osaka get reinforcements?
4. Is the computer AI programmed to transport troops from outlying area back to the Japanese homeland?
H. Lo
Previously played:
Uncommon Valor
War In The Pacific: AE
War Plan Orange
Steel Panthers series
A couple quick answers:
1) Tokyo gets a ration of fuel and supplies every turn. It's possible, but I think unlikely, that you'll have so many Japanese troops in Tokyo to run it to zero and leave a substantial portion of the troops unsupplied on a turn by turn basis.
2) No comment.
3) I recall that some reinforcements do arrive at Osaka.
4) I haven't observed the Japanese AI reinforcing the Home Islands, but I haven't played a lot in a "Siege of Japan" phase of the campaign.
1. Tokyo receives 8000 supplies and 1000 fuel daily. It is close to impossible to get them out of supplies. Doesn't sound very realistic. Some mods (like GPW, Cuationaries) tried to simulate Japan's blockade by moving the supply sources off Japan.
2. Nothing. see 1. [;)]
3. Depending on scenario setup. IIRC, Tokyo, Hiroshima and Osaka do get reinforcements.
4. you will tell us [&:] [;)] [:'(] [:D]
The computer AI for Japan may be trying to bring some troops back but I cannot confirm it without some amount of work. Work means I'll have to load the saved games as both Allies and Japan each turn and see what are in the convoys heading to the home islands.
However when I look at the battle reports when there were surface action just outside the Tokyo hex, it mentioned the loss of troops when the ships went down. I have to admit that I don't know which ways the convoys are going.
H. Lo
Previously played:
Uncommon Valor
War In The Pacific: AE
War Plan Orange
Steel Panthers series
you should have seen me try to capture tokyo in WITP in november of 1945, that was bloody murder....
for 3 weeks there was 113 IJA and IJN units in it....they had little or no supply that entire time, prior to assaulting it i had around 7,000 aircraft of all types (including 3,000 level bombers...1,700 of which were B-29's captable of carrying a 2400 lbs bomb load) bombing them around the clock for a month straight, it was cut off on every side and had virtually no supplies, along with this i had 36 battleships and about 40 cruisers, bombarding them about 70% of the time....for 3 weeks i did that, then i sent in a combined allied force of 21,500 assault strength (chinese, americans, canadians, british and russians) with 272,000 infantry and 2,500 tanks, i did a 4,000 gun artillery bombardment for 3 days before moving in and the bastards held out for about 2 weeks in that city and i was losing way more than them in my attacks (sometimes 10 allied soldiers for every jap, but always at least 3 for 1)...on the first day i lost 35,000 allied infantry and the japs only lost about 4,000, i tried a pure tank attack and all it resulted in was 1,000 jap casualties losing around 10 guns and 3,500 allied casualties with about 100 tanks and 30 guns lost..in the end the battle for tokyo costed me about 600,000 allied ground casualties alone, not to mention all the pilots i lost, as almost to the very end of the battle they met a torrent of anti-aircraft fire every time they flew over the city....was it worth it? hell yes and that wasnt gonna lose me the war, also the japs lost about 900,000 men total and the heart of their empire, but have no mistake, the battle for tokyo can be like the battle for berlin was, that appauling, desperate urban slogging match
i imagine in WPO itll be just as hard, they might not have as many units but you dont have the overwhelming air and naval support i did so itll probably be just as hard as my fight was....all i can say is this - massive bombardment for weeks or even months prior is mandatory and its a good idea to capture all outlying cities first...ground combat must be alot harder in this game, no air support :\ i mean in witp as the allies in late game, at any given time you can call on 3,000 heavy bombers to ruin a place, then wave after wave of fighter bombers and carrier aircraft if you want
for me, there wasnt a whole lot there but some troops almost always get funneled there from Shimizu and the city 1 hex NW, plus they had moved troops into it as i was advancing from the north and from the west as i had advanced, i dunno if they put this in on purpose - but no matter what tokyo always seems particularily hard to capture, more so than any other 9 fort base for any amount of troops it might have in it at the time, its like the japs suddenly become fanatical and fight better in their capital...maybe the size of the city and more detailed factors? the fact that its the capital and theyve had years to prepare it for possible invasion? i dont know
also, does this game see any considerate carrier vs carrier scraps later in the game? or is it just to small? i dont care for huge battles but it would be cool to see the early carriers duke it out...do the neat little bi-planes from the carriers engage in dogfights over the sea? im thinking of getting this game
i think it would be neat to try this game as a witp player and go to the pioneer age of modern naval warfare, it looks pretty interesting
the japs start w/2 CVs, get a 3rd in about 14 months, and a 4th in 2 years & 2 months (all have 13 ftr, 13 TB)
the yanks start w/1 CV (22 ftr, 11 TB), get another in 7 months, and a last one in 2 years, 7 months (both w/11ftr, 11TB)
it's a lot more surface combat oriented, and the carriers seem to be more mosquito type nuisances than killers although they do get their share of kills if the other player is not careful. it's a laid back type of game, and once you get in the groove turns take 10 minutes each. since it uses the WitP engine in a different way you might find it an interesting way of seeing how the engine works for little used areas of WitP (which is occasionally more of a bad thing than a good thing!)
In my Western Citadel scenario I've seen several carrier battles or carrier vs. land battles.
Wake: Langley vs. Hosho & Shokaku
Wake: Langley vs. Shokaku (Hosho was sunk in round 1)
Mariana's: Langley & Yorktown vs. the third Japanese carrier
Philippines: Hosho & Shokaku vs. Clark Field
In one of the Wake battles, the carrier sank in harbor so the IJN was able to off-load the air wing to the atoll. They ended up providing an effective CAP and one of the IJN flight officers became an ace on taking down pilots from the US CV's.
I've also seen the British Far East Fleet catch the IJN carrier force in a surface action off Singapore in the opening rounds. Dreadnought and Repulse plus their escorts vs. a lot of CL's and DD's protecting the CV's.
An experienced torpedo squadron can sink a pre-dreadnought or damage a modern dreadnought if they operate without air cover in the late scenario.
yea that would be perfect engineer, just a little pioneer carrier warfare like that mixed in, i was under the impression that even by 1918 carriers were becoming farely effective
you should link me to that western citadel scenario, id appreciate that
