Future Directions - Data Content
Moderators: Panther Paul, Arjuna
Future Directions - Data Content
Hi all,
Here is where you can discuss what data content we should focus on - ie what battles we should cover, how you would like them packaged ( eg expansion packs, separate games etc ) and how best to coordinate between community developed data content and that produced by Panther Games.
Please keep any discussion on price to the designated threads.
We are very much looking forward to your feedback on data content.
What we have in the works already are some scenarios covering the HTTR battles. We can't just use the old HTTR scenarios as too much has changed to salvage these. So they havge to be rebuilt from scratch. We have already converted the maps. The BFTB estabs include the HTTR estabs. We have developed five of the large scenarios so far. One option is to develop a suite of say 10 or so scenarios and release an expansion pack for HTTR. We could probably do that over the next few months.
Another option is to convert the COTA estabs. This will be a fairly big job. From there we could develop and release a COTA expansion pack. The COTA estabs would provide options to cover a lot of the pre 1943 battles on the western front. They would need to be further exanded upon to cater for specific forces in say the western desert theatre, France 1940 etc.
A further option would be to develop a set of east front estabs so we could cover a plethora of east front battles. Again it may be worth while separating this into early war years 1941/42/43 and later war years 44/45.
I have to go right now. Please feel free to post on what you think would be a good direction to head in for developing future data content.
Here is where you can discuss what data content we should focus on - ie what battles we should cover, how you would like them packaged ( eg expansion packs, separate games etc ) and how best to coordinate between community developed data content and that produced by Panther Games.
Please keep any discussion on price to the designated threads.
We are very much looking forward to your feedback on data content.
What we have in the works already are some scenarios covering the HTTR battles. We can't just use the old HTTR scenarios as too much has changed to salvage these. So they havge to be rebuilt from scratch. We have already converted the maps. The BFTB estabs include the HTTR estabs. We have developed five of the large scenarios so far. One option is to develop a suite of say 10 or so scenarios and release an expansion pack for HTTR. We could probably do that over the next few months.
Another option is to convert the COTA estabs. This will be a fairly big job. From there we could develop and release a COTA expansion pack. The COTA estabs would provide options to cover a lot of the pre 1943 battles on the western front. They would need to be further exanded upon to cater for specific forces in say the western desert theatre, France 1940 etc.
A further option would be to develop a set of east front estabs so we could cover a plethora of east front battles. Again it may be worth while separating this into early war years 1941/42/43 and later war years 44/45.
I have to go right now. Please feel free to post on what you think would be a good direction to head in for developing future data content.
- axisandallies
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
If you did a game on the Eastern Front, you might get alot of new players. I feel you would have many more options then on the western front.
Stupid rebellion, anyhow....D. Vader
RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Only one choice when it comes to what I'd like to see in an upcoming title: the Winter and the Continuation wars.
Ich hoffe, dass ich keinen langweile...
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Will a "doctrine editor" ever be released? Would it even be possible to create one?
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- Panther Paul
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
ORIGINAL: KEYSTONE07950
Will a "doctrine editor" ever be released? Would it even be possible to create one?
No.
The Doctrine is all the code that goes into planning a move, attack etc.
The game is set up so that there can be seperate code modules for planning an attack, and the module to use can be set in the estab data.
Its just never been used.
Paul Scobell
Panther Games Pty Ltd
Panther Games Pty Ltd
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Good news!
Personally, I'd love to see either Normandy or Sicily/Italy content but they don't necessarily fit all that well as expansions to existing titles (especially the latter). The conversion of COTA estabs would be nice especially if it did lead to France 1940 or North Africa, I'd be very happy to see that.
From a less selfish point of view, however, I suspect that Eastern Front material would be very popular across the community and potentially bring barrow-loads of new players. Where you would start with that one is a difficult one though, almost limitless possibilities.
Personally, I'd love to see either Normandy or Sicily/Italy content but they don't necessarily fit all that well as expansions to existing titles (especially the latter). The conversion of COTA estabs would be nice especially if it did lead to France 1940 or North Africa, I'd be very happy to see that.
From a less selfish point of view, however, I suspect that Eastern Front material would be very popular across the community and potentially bring barrow-loads of new players. Where you would start with that one is a difficult one though, almost limitless possibilities.
RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Since this seems to be a smaller project and part of it has been done already, this might be a good idea as the next project. As long as it covers the main scenarios (XXX Corps breakout, entire 101st/82nd/1st areas), this sounds good. I would highly suggest making this a standalone expansion, though. Many devs are doing this nowadays; it builds up on the current engine (BFTB), but doesn't require owning the vanilla game. This will thus allow sales from people interested in Market-Garden, but who don't own BFTB for whatever reason.What we have in the works already are some scenarios covering the HTTR battles. We can't just use the old HTTR scenarios as too much has changed to salvage these. So they havge to be rebuilt from scratch. We have already converted the maps. The BFTB estabs include the HTTR estabs. We have developed five of the large scenarios so far. One option is to develop a suite of say 10 or so scenarios and release an expansion pack for HTTR. We could probably do that over the next few months.
Personally, I'd be pretty interested in this, especially the western desert theater. However, if it'll be a large task, it might be too much of an undertaking at the moment.Another option is to convert the COTA estabs. This will be a fairly big job. From there we could develop and release a COTA expansion pack. The COTA estabs would provide options to cover a lot of the pre 1943 battles on the western front. They would need to be further exanded upon to cater for specific forces in say the western desert theatre, France 1940 etc.
I think a lot of wargamers would be more for this. If you're going to invest into a larger project, this probably will appeal to more players than your previous option.A further option would be to develop a set of east front estabs so we could cover a plethora of east front battles. Again it may be worth while separating this into early war years 1941/42/43 and later war years 44/45.
So would I!Personally, I'd love to see either Normandy or Sicily/Italy content
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Expansion packs to fill in Western Europe/ NA (no particular order):
-Normandy/Market Garden/Westwall (44-45)- (need off map/naval gunfire and amphibious assault code)
-Gazala thru Italy (42-43)- (minefields etc.)
-Blitzkrieg & France '40 (39-41 COTA update)
-Off The Beaten Path: Leb/Syria, East Africa, Madagascar, Dodecanese, Spanish Civil War, etc.
Next Major Title: Eastern Front
Develop in parallel with west front expansion packs below. Focus on highest impact engine changes, and campaign game, but not so advanced that it's not backward patchable. It'll help to get another revenue producer on the market quickly, too. Create the campaign game that covers periods from the entire war- to limit the scope to something manageable, maybe cover battles from Zhukov's career. It can go from 1939 (Japan, welcome to Command Ops) to 1945. Expansion packs for Stalingrad/Saturn, Kharkov, Kursk, all the usual east front suspects.
Title After That: Pacific War/Korea
I included Korea to expand both the pool of potential interesting battles and nations, but also to stretch the era covered a little. A must-have for all the jarheads, but lots of nationalities would get a showing. The stuff's there to model some early cold war hypotheticals for expansion pack material perhaps.
Title After That: Modern/Late Cold War. I said this since I think it'd have more appeal than going back in time from WW2, but doing earlier times might be easier to implement- less fancy equipment to worry about. This has to be 3-D and have sophisicated air support modelling. Vietnam, Arab-Israeli, Fulda Gap
Title after that: US Civil war/Franco-Prussian war. This actually might be a good vehicle for when the system stretches into longer campaign modeling and implementing new AI doctrines. No air (maybe balloons), no mechanization could maybe make the development easier, and get the framework established that can be expanded upon later. So even though I put this last, maybe it should go up top.
-Normandy/Market Garden/Westwall (44-45)- (need off map/naval gunfire and amphibious assault code)
-Gazala thru Italy (42-43)- (minefields etc.)
-Blitzkrieg & France '40 (39-41 COTA update)
-Off The Beaten Path: Leb/Syria, East Africa, Madagascar, Dodecanese, Spanish Civil War, etc.
Next Major Title: Eastern Front
Develop in parallel with west front expansion packs below. Focus on highest impact engine changes, and campaign game, but not so advanced that it's not backward patchable. It'll help to get another revenue producer on the market quickly, too. Create the campaign game that covers periods from the entire war- to limit the scope to something manageable, maybe cover battles from Zhukov's career. It can go from 1939 (Japan, welcome to Command Ops) to 1945. Expansion packs for Stalingrad/Saturn, Kharkov, Kursk, all the usual east front suspects.
Title After That: Pacific War/Korea
I included Korea to expand both the pool of potential interesting battles and nations, but also to stretch the era covered a little. A must-have for all the jarheads, but lots of nationalities would get a showing. The stuff's there to model some early cold war hypotheticals for expansion pack material perhaps.
Title After That: Modern/Late Cold War. I said this since I think it'd have more appeal than going back in time from WW2, but doing earlier times might be easier to implement- less fancy equipment to worry about. This has to be 3-D and have sophisicated air support modelling. Vietnam, Arab-Israeli, Fulda Gap
Title after that: US Civil war/Franco-Prussian war. This actually might be a good vehicle for when the system stretches into longer campaign modeling and implementing new AI doctrines. No air (maybe balloons), no mechanization could maybe make the development easier, and get the framework established that can be expanded upon later. So even though I put this last, maybe it should go up top.
_______________________
I'll think about putting something here one of these days...
I'll think about putting something here one of these days...
RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Congratulations Dave on the BftB release, most awesome, you definitely sit at the pinnacle of wargaming development. Although its not my personal preference I agree with the other posters here that the East Front is most likely to bring in a larger clientele and after all successful marketing is the best catalyst to sustain this most innovative engine.
So go East young man!
After that, I would appreciate a visit to North Africa. In my mind I conjure up visions of the smaller unit engagements that were the norm for that theater. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the Panther engine is best suited for this scale of action. There is not a lot of unit density, vast landscapes, and the nuances of the Command Ops gameplay can easily be player familiarized in a less demanding environment that this limited theater presents.
Just some thoughts, and i raise my frozen margarita to a toast of this most formidable wargaming engine, thank you Dave and the rest of the "Prowlers'.
So go East young man!
After that, I would appreciate a visit to North Africa. In my mind I conjure up visions of the smaller unit engagements that were the norm for that theater. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the Panther engine is best suited for this scale of action. There is not a lot of unit density, vast landscapes, and the nuances of the Command Ops gameplay can easily be player familiarized in a less demanding environment that this limited theater presents.
Just some thoughts, and i raise my frozen margarita to a toast of this most formidable wargaming engine, thank you Dave and the rest of the "Prowlers'.
- Fallschirmjager
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
North Africa
Either Tobruk 41
El Alamein
Tunisia 43
Any of the three
Either Tobruk 41
El Alamein
Tunisia 43
Any of the three
RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Eastern front would be awesome!
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager
North Africa
Yeah, the more I think about NA, the more I like it. For me, Compass, Sunflower, Battleaxe and then Crusader in one package would be wargaming heaven [:)]
RE: Future Directions - Data Content
ORIGINAL: Llyranor
Since this seems to be a smaller project and part of it has been done already, this might be a good idea as the next project. As long as it covers the main scenarios (XXX Corps breakout, entire 101st/82nd/1st areas), this sounds good. I would highly suggest making this a standalone expansion, though. Many devs are doing this nowadays; it builds up on the current engine (BFTB), but doesn't require owning the vanilla game. This will thus allow sales from people interested in Market-Garden, but who don't own BFTB for whatever reason.
I can see merit in this approach but I also merit in the more traditional approach of requiring the original BFTB game. If we do a standalone then we'll have to do a full set of manuals, a new tutorial and a full set of tutorial movies. These took between four and five months of my time to develop. If we are also to add any new features, then it would be better to avoid what is in effect a duplication of effort. If we require BFTB, then all we need is a What's New manual and a What's New movie. This would be a lot less effort and could mean we get the data content out to you guys a lot quicker.
- Prince of Eckmühl
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
I'm a North Africa nut, and I can't help but believe that the Aussies associated with AA/COP didn't start out with that in mind in the first place. The engine really shines when you turn it loose in the desert. Build it, and I will buy.
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- SgtChaudart
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
I'm french therefore I'll be very happy to see France 1940 of course
I would like to see the asian front like Burma or the Pacific.
And to finish, few modern conflict like Indochina, Korean, Vietnam.
I would like to see the asian front like Burma or the Pacific.
And to finish, few modern conflict like Indochina, Korean, Vietnam.
- ElchDivision
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
ORIGINAL: Chaudart
I'm french therefore I'll be very happy to see France 1940 of course
I would like to see the asian front like Burma or the Pacific.
And to finish, few modern conflict like Indochina, Korean, Vietnam.
France 1940? Would be to short for a standalone game, that could be done in a small add-on [:D]
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Rest peacefully in foreign soil - Never forgotten
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
ORIGINAL: Arjuna
...
A further option would be to develop a set of east front estabs so we could cover a plethora of east front battles. Again it may be worth while separating this into early war years 1941/42/43 and later war years 44/45.
...
This gets my vote.
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
Nice to hear Market Garden scenarios are getting remake.
Some Normandy action should be in order.
I don't know of any other significant operations in the Western Front late in the war. Maybe Italy.
I suggest BftB be the standard game from now on and everything else comes as modules and engine improvements. That way all theaters will benefit from all upgrades.
Some Normandy action should be in order.
I don't know of any other significant operations in the Western Front late in the war. Maybe Italy.
I suggest BftB be the standard game from now on and everything else comes as modules and engine improvements. That way all theaters will benefit from all upgrades.
- ElchDivision
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
The siege of Leningrad 41/42 offers a vast amount of smaller battles and skirmishes, maybe that could be realized aswell.
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RE: Future Directions - Data Content
North Africa and Italy for me, please! I'm not that interested in the Eastern front, although I realise I'm in a tiny minority.
And if it's just data content I'd rather it be add-ons as opposed to standalone. More data quicker is better as far as I'm concerned.
And if it's just data content I'd rather it be add-ons as opposed to standalone. More data quicker is better as far as I'm concerned.